Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Willkommen Collective

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. MBisanz ^talk 23:25, 11 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Willkommen Collective

Walled garden of articles about a "Brighton-based pool of friends and musicians" and its various members and bands and record labels, all created the same day by the same author, Marcushamblett (talk · contribs). The articles cross-refer to each other a lot, but the only sources are Myspace and their own web-sites - nothing from any independent reliable source to indicate notability to anything like the standard of WP:MUSIC; nor have I been able to find any. Probable self-promotion, from the way they all appeared at once, and in any case non-notable. Delete all. JohnCD (talk) 10:26, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Delete all - Auf wiedersehen, au revoir, see you! WP:NOT myspace. AlexTiefling (talk) 11:02, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Delete all, could also be Speedy deleted. Next time you feel like making a web page for yourself and your pals, try a free web host. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 12:24, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Don't Delete as you said above, it was me who made all these pages, please indicate what kind of independent reliable sources I could reference to prove that these bands are notable. They all tour the UK, have albums available in record shops worldwide and are featured in magazines, I don't see how they can be condemned as non-notable so easily. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.74.13.67 (talk) 12:48, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Can you provide an example of a chain of record shops - even in the UK - who stock these bands' music? A cursory Google search suggests they're unsigned. AlexTiefling (talk) 14:07, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Hi Alex. Here's the Sons of Noel and Adrian album at HMV:

http://hmv.com/hmvweb/simpleSearch.do?searchUID=&pGroupID=-1&adultFlag=false&primaryID=-1&simpleSearchString=sons+of+noel+and+adrian&btnSubmitSearch.x=0&btnSubmitSearch.y=0 and here it is at Zavvi: http://www.zavvi.co.uk/sons+of+noel+and+adrian-Sons-Of-Noel-And-Adrian-Sons-Of-Noel-And-Adrian/852073/q.r10.1/p.jsf Here's the Shoreline album at Zavvi: http://www.zavvi.co.uk/shoreline-music-Shoreline-Time-Well-Spent/881718/qc.r10.1/p.jsf

- The other bands mentioned - Hope of the States, Lightspeed Champion, The Accidental, David Thomas Broughton, She Talks To Angels etc. all also have albums in all majour chain stores. I can provide Amazon links if needed? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.74.13.67 (talk) 15:14, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Delete all per nom. Note to the articles' author: you may want to read WP:N and WP:BAND for more information. ~~SIS~~ 14:09, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- I would say all the bands mentioned at least qualify for points 1, 6 and 11 in WP:BAND —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.74.13.67 (talk) 15:17, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  - Let's examine it, then. #1 is "It has been the subject of multiple non-trivial published works whose source is independent from the musician/ensemble itself and reliable." What articles in magazines, newspapers, broadcast radio stations or TV shows have featured this band? (Webpages, blogs, Myspace or Youtube don't count.) Or #6: "Contains at least one notable musician." This means someone who in his own right fulfills the criteria of WP:MUSIC. Whom would that be? #11 is works in rotation on a national radio network; are there links proving this? Delete all. RGTraynor 15:42, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    - 1: Sons of Noel and Adrian have been featured in several print magazines including Blues Matters, Acoustic Magazine, Dazed and Congfused Rock Sound (including a track on the cover CD). 6: At least two members of the bands/collective fulfill WP:MUSIC in their own right, Nick Hemming (whose page is not disputed) and Mike Siddell, who is in the NME-cover-stars Lightspeed Champion. 11: Yes, http://www.bbc.co.uk/6music/shows/tom_robinson/tracklisting.shtml?y=2008&d=20080212 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.74.13.67 (talk) 16:19, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: They are not totally unheard of it appears, although I'm not very familiar with the requirements for music on WP. Dazed Digital has a brief interview. There is a review at Line of Best Fit. I can't vouch for the websites, though. - AdamBMorgan (talk) 16:35, 7 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Here's another review, from DrownedinSound.com, Europe's largest music website (second in the world only to PitchforkMedia.com): http://drownedinsound.com/releases/13181, surely this proves notability? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Marcushamblett (talk • contribs) 08:48, 8 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Delete all: per all of the above. -- Gmatsuda (talk) 01:05, 8 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- You say Delete all, as per all of the above, but above I believe I've shown that the bands meet three of the critera required by WP:MUSIC when they need only meet one to qualify for notability? --Marcushamblett (talk) 09:43, 8 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Delete each, unless, sources mentioned are found and added to the articles. Having an album in large chain stores is not sufficient to pass even the less stringent requirments of WP:Music. With only one album, they still each need reliable independant sources with non-trivial coverage to confirm any notability, which they don't have. I've seen Lightspeed Champion at a festival, but never heard of the others, and the bands notability is not inherited by it's members and then transmitted to his friends.. Non-trivial coverage != mention of releases, it needs in depth reviews, articles, or interviews for each of them. Note, while the bands may be notable enough, the "collective" needs to prove notability independantly, it is not enough to assume it is notable enough just because some of it's members are.Yobmod (talk) 07:48, 9 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Okay - so should I add external links in the articles to reviews, radio playlists and interviews, even if they're not references backing up points in the articles, just to show notability? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.74.13.67 (talk) 09:00, 9 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.