Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Walter Beer

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. As people have pointed out, "notability is not inherited" (WP:NOTINHERITED), merely being associated with someobody notable does not imply notability itself. And nobody here is showing that WP:BIO is met. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 09:20, 8 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Walter Beer

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Non-notable individual lacking in-depth, non-trivial support. References are single-line mentions and a "paid notice" obit. Fails to provide support for WP:N. reddogsix (talk) 01:41, 23 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of New York-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 06:55, 23 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Law-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 06:55, 23 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Outdated Comment: reddogsix's initial recommendation is now outdated due to updates to entry, which include more details and more links to still other notable people.

Comment - Nothing of substance has changed since the nomination except perhaps the addition of unrelated fluff. reddogsix (talk) 15:28, 23 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Notability: The online citations used to compile this entry on Walter Beer demonstrate close connection to and strong support for Alger Hiss, a major figure in 20th Century American history. Beer studied with Hiss at Harvard Law. Beer's law firm provided at least three lawyers who defended Hiss at various points in time during his 50-year battle to assert his innocence. Please read the Alger Hiss entry before any consideration for deletion of Walter Beer stub. --Aboudaqn (talk) 14:42, 23 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - Simply put notability is not inherited. reddogsix (talk) 15:28, 23 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Keep for now - the stub currently only gives a bare curriculum vita of the subject - he was born, he went to law school, started a law firm etc. It mentions, in passing, the Alger Hiss case, but doesnt go into detail about what his involvement was. Lets wait and see if we can get any RS about what he did to be notable.--Bellerophon5685 (talk) 17:43, 23 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - So your !vote is to keep a non-notable article? reddogsix (talk) 15:26, 27 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The argument is that this is a "stub." --Aboudaqn (talk) 20:28, 27 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

My argument is that if this article can be improved with RS to show notability then it should be kept. If no notability can be established then it should be deleted.--Bellerophon5685 (talk) 23:13, 29 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 16:46, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Businesspeople-related deletion discussions. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 16:46, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nom. Alger Hiss hired Beer ... "as general counsel to pass on contracts and other corporate problems".[1] Whoopee. That's about it, so GNG and BIO are definitely not satisfied. Clarityfiend (talk) 00:48, 1 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep Have added new details, which help underscore Beer's importance. Considerations: "Beer" is the lead name of the firm. Beer and his partners and attorneys worked for years to keep Hiss afloat. Just because Beer himself is (per current references) the least helpful contributor in terms of any kind of direct legal contribution does not lessen the fact that its Beer (via his firm Beer) that works so hard for Hiss – and in so many aspects of his life, whether (1) in Hiss's lifelong fight to regain his reputation (Rosenwald, Lane), (2) in personal affairs (Buttenwieser), or (3) in his subsequent professional career (Beer). Of all these people, Beer is the one who knew him from Harvard days back in the late 1920s: he is the glue. For anyone interested in this case, it sure would be great to "click" on "Walter Beer" and find his role – IMHO, "notable" as in very much worth noting and knowing. --Aboudaqn (talk) 17:28, 2 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  - Comment - How does any of this support WP:N? There is no evidence he was directly involved in the Hiss case. You seem to be stuck on the thinking that Wikipedia WP:N is the same as "real-world" notability. Not so... reddogsix (talk) 18:18, 2 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

- New Lede This new addition to the lede might complete the "keep" argument: "he [Beer] and many of his associated lawyers defended Alger Hiss in criminal, corporate, and personal matters." — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aboudaqn (talk • contribs)
  - Comment - Hardly, there is no evidence provided that he defended Hiss. You are using a circular argument that since the article says that, it must be true. Not so. reddogsix (talk) 18:14, 2 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - lack of significant coverage. The keep arguments are not grounded in policy. PhilKnight (talk) 01:52, 8 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.