Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Vermont Group

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete. Neutrality^talk 13:56, 8 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Vermont Group[edit]

This is a non-notable group of Diplomacy (game) players. It has only 107 unique Google results in English. The founder's article is listed below. -- Kjkolb 00:28, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Delete as per nom. Dlyons493 Talk 05:06, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, although we don't have a guideline to help us decide on including groups of Diplomacy players. Someone should go write one right away. Jkelly 06:59, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom. --Jeffrey O. Gustafson - Shazaam! - <*> 06:52, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Delete online board-gaming group. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 10:22, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - nn CLW 11:06, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - nn. Dottore So 20:56, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Weak delete. This group is worldwide and is one of the most significant groups in the Diplomacy (game) hobby, but by WP's standards it's just another online game-related group, and doesn't have Google or Alexa evidence of notability. If I used the arguments of some AfD voters, the WP:Importance criterion "is of interest to a community" would garner this article my "Keep" vote. Barno 21:00, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Good point, and that raises the question of whether the community is itself of note then, and deserving of an independent, encyclopedic article (which in this case I don't think is the case). Dottore So 23:04, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The Diplomacy community definitely is notable and article-worthy. First play-by-mail historical game, first game hobby to spawn hundreds of fanzines published nationally and internationally, championships in nearly twenty nations, a long-established world championship convention (not just an online tourney calling itself "world championship"), organizations that provide real functions and not just chat forums, coverage in mainstream media, and so forth. Favorite game of Walter Cronkite, John F. Kennedy, and Henry Kissinger, although that might not be so notable a point. It's far more notable than most of the MMORPGs whose adherents think they should have their clans and forums and hacker-groups listed in WP. Barno 17:37, 4 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Very interesting. I think I would include all that in the Diplomacy (game) article, though, instead of a separate Diplomacy Community article. That's just my preference though. I certainly am in total agreement concerning your sentiments about the plethora of insignficant MMORPGs. Dottore So 12:15, 6 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

- - Comment. I'd suggest that the Diplomacy (game) article wouldn't be hurt by adding some information to it. I notice that it is completely unreferenced at the moment and contains inline external links. Jkelly 03:44, 5 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
    - Agree with Jkelly. -- Kjkolb 04:33, 5 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.