Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Vaughan Road Academy

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. --Core desat 03:56, 12 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Vaughan Road Academy

This AFD is for Vaughan Road Academy. The article is proposed for deletion. This is not a vote.

Delete the article: This article does not cite its sources. Parts of it are written like a highschool essay. It appears to be for a non-notable highschool. =::..note this afd has been listed at Wikipedia:Watch/schoolwatch/Schools for deletion archive Gnan garra 06:54, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Delete: I support deleting this article for the above reasons. Spa toss 20:19, 6 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

— Spa toss (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. Even the name seems to be indicating it's a single purpose account. The editor's only edits have been to this AfD and an attempt at retaliation at another article.

Oppose: Vaughan Road Academy has some notable alumni such as William Hutt (actor) and Al Waxman. This is found in the school's hallway. Johnny Au 20:44, 6 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: Notable alumni does not necessarily establish notability for the school. And a school's hallway is not necessarily a useful source at Wikipedia. Spa toss 22:17, 6 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

This AfD nomination was incomplete. It is listed now. DumbBOT 14:06, 7 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Strong Keep a distinguished and notable school with numerous notable alumni -- including a Nobel prize winner -- all backed up and supported by ample reliable and verifiable sources to satisfy the Wikipedia:Notability standard. Alansohn 18:11, 7 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: It is possible that the school has notable students but itself is not notable. Spa toss 20:31, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - I can't imagine why we would delete this comprehensive and well-sourced article about a high school with a long history and many notable alumni. --orlady 05:26, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: The article doesn't appear to list any sources. Spa toss 20:32, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Nevermind, it looks like sources are being added. Spa toss 20:34, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Weak Delete notability not established article uses primary source only, as per WP:V the subject needs to have been covered by multiple independent reliable sources. Gnangarra 06:52, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
- Is the Toronto Star a primary source? Alansohn 20:24, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  - Toronto star article is about a person not the school, as such it doesnt provide anything in relation to the article subject notability isnt transferable, inherited, gifted or in any other the result of some other person notability . Gnan garra 07:34, 10 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Delete no assertion of notability per my views on the subject. Eusebeus 15:10, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Speedy keep, all secondary schools are notable per WP:SCHOOL, especially ones over 80 years old. Article could use some clean up though. Leuko 20:45, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I just read WP:SCHOOL, and it has other criteria besides secondary and age. Some of which may have been met since the afd was proposed. Spa toss 21:02, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Weak Delete per lack of sources covering this school. All I see are directory listings and small mentions on pages about alumns. WP:SCHOOL is defunct now and nowhere does it say that any school is inherently notable Corpx 03:27, 9 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. This is a distinguished and notable school with numerous notable alumni including a Nobel prize winner, obviously it is sufficiently notable. Burntsauce 18:03, 9 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Comment on notability transfer from notable person to school (or other buildings) they visited, frequented, studied in...: This argument is not good even if true. Notability of persons who happened to attend the school gives the school no more notabilty than it would if a notable person had frequented my neighborhood McDonalds. Now, if you have a relaible source associating a notable person with the school, that would be different. School hallways are reliable sources. Spa toss 18:28, 9 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Comment:Writing an article on the McDonalds at Waco Texas simply because both George Bush and David Koresh (two notable people) ate there does not establish the notablity of the McDonalds at Waco Texas. Spa toss 18:36, 9 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Keep theres a significant difference between a one time visit, and several years of daily school attendance. This isnt a George Washington slept here argument. ALKIVAR™ ☢ 19:04, 9 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Comment:It wouldn't matter if George Bush and David Koresh ate at the McDonalds at Waco Texas everyday for several years. You would need independant second party RS to make the observation, and to make the subject notable. Are you suggesting that these notable alumni would not have been notable if they had attended a different school? If so, you'll need a RS to back you up. Spa toss 19:26, 9 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

(Indenting adjusted above; please readjust if this changes the intent of any editor affected). The article does provide reliable sources for these individuals and their attendance at (and connection to) the school, a school at which they spent several hours per day for several hundred days, having attended just about every day for a four-year period. I agree that it would be very hard to make a causal connection between one's eating regularly at a particular McDonald's and the person they became down the line, though perhaps an excellent case could be made for Bill Clinton. In contrast, the attendance of these notables at Vaughan Road Academy and their participation and instruction in athletic, drama and science programs offered by the school is inextricably linked to their ultimate notability as a professional football player, actor or Nobel Prize winner. The widely-accepted practice of recognizing notability for a school based on notability of alumni who have attended the school is based on the recognition that a school, and especially a high school, plays an integral role in shaping the future notable, all with reliable and verifiable sources demonstrating their connection to the school. No similar case could be made for a notable having eaten at a restaurant or slept in a home having any causal connection influencing the individual's future notability. Alansohn 20:09, 9 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

FWIW, the nominator has left the building. --orlady 23:20, 9 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per the strong arguments made above, the notability of this school is clear, and a dozen different reliable sources all confirm this. Silensor 07:45, 10 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Keep The very notable alumni are sufficient for notability--very much so. What makes schools notable? Most of the time, what their student accomplish. If those who though all schools notable would instead pay attention to the individual characteristics in their arguments, we'd get more good ones kept with less difficulty. If the people who wanted to delete it would pay attention instead to the non-notable schools that are still so prevalent in WP, they too would accomplish more. A really strange nomination, this one. 08:12, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Close?

It doesn't appear that further discussion is likely to lead to a concensus to delete. So should we closed the Afd, and remove the tag? Spa toss 03:14, 10 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Does that mean you are withdrawing the nomination? Leuko 13:47, 10 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.