Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Third Reich NSDAP cabinet 1925

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. BusterD (talk) 21:33, 25 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Third Reich NSDAP cabinet 1925[edit]

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I believe this is a simple hoax, or if not a hoax, fringe theory or original research. There was no Third Reich in 1925. There was no NSDAP cabinet in 1925. The central claim, that the former crown prince pledged allegiance to the Nazis, is unsourced. Even if true, it does not validate the claim that this was the Third Reich, or that there was an NDSAP cabinet in 1925. Mccapra (talk) 20:27, 18 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Germany-related deletion discussions. Mccapra (talk) 20:27, 18 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Politics-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 20:30, 18 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
This article has been deleted, then restored. I stated that This page should not be speedy deleted as pure vandalism or a blatant hoax, because... (your reason here) --Stephen2nd (talk) 18:33, 18 January 2023 (UTC) These 22 members of the 1925 cabinet meeting of NSDAP, have been listed on the German Wikipedia for several years, the 22 member numbers are each individually referenced from 22 published authors. All I have done is transferred these numbers to the English Wikipedia, and added images to them. The details of the 22 individuals, are taken directly from their existing articles on their names. As an editor for several years, I believe that cross referencing existing allowed Wikipedia articles should not be disallowed. If you wish to change the title or any of the text you are welcome. Please keep the article until this matter has been debated. Stephen2nd (talk) 18:33, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

What has changed? Stephen2nd (talk) 20:56, 18 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. The claim that there was some sort of cabinet within the Nazi party in 1925 is completely unsourced. And as stated above, the Nazis wouldn't come to power until the next decade, so it wouldn't have been a "Third Reich" cabinet anyways. Jahaza (talk) 21:47, 18 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Just a comment; Nazi Party#:~:text=On 16 February 1925, Hitler,of taking power by force. Flibbertigibbets (talk) 04:44, 19 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I guess the German article being mentioned is de:Liste von NSDAP-Parteimitgliedsnummern which already has an English version. Giving a modicum of benefit of doubt, I still simply find no sourcing to indicate any significance to this particular set of Nazis by early membership number, this particular year, let alone the existence of a "Third Reich cabinet" of 1925. Regards, --Goldsztajn (talk) 09:09, 19 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, no sources for the main claim, no justification for the title. According to the German Wikipedia, the number 24 for August Wilhelm von Preußen was issued in 1930, so this meeting is probably nonexistent. —Kusma (talk) 10:00, 19 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Wikipedia reference: Article - Nazi Party: Section - Rise to power: 1925–1933.

Adolf Hitler was released from prison on 20 December 1924. On 16 February 1925, Hitler convinced the Bavarian authorities to lift the ban on the NSDAP and the party was formally refounded on 26 February 1925, with Hitler as its undisputed leader. The new Nazi Party was no longer a paramilitary organisation and disavowed any intention of taking power by force.

This was edited into the Nazi Germany article in 2017. The article has had 7,773,488 pageviews, with an average of 3,839 views per day, for the last 2024 days. None of these 7.7m viewers contested its inclusion. Stephen2nd (talk) 16:12, 19 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The above is true but totally irrelevant. Mccapra (talk) 17:15, 19 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

After the NSDAP ban was lifted, the refounded NSDAP in 1925 was the Nazi Party.

The numbers (1 – 24) led by Hitler, were the first 22 members of NSDAP from 1925.

The political structure of the new Nazi Party led by number (1); Author: Mein Kampf (political manifesto). (to his left) 2. Publisher: Mein Kampf. 3. NSDAP Business manager. 4. NSDAP Chairman. 5. NSDAP State Leader. 6. NSDAP National Treasurer. 8. NSDAP: National Leader for Propaganda. 9. NSDAP: parliamentary group leader. 10. NSDAP Party Leader. 11. NSDAP Deputy Manager.

13. NSDAP official Lawyer. 15. Hitler's Private secretary. &c. Stephen2nd (talk) 18:54, 19 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Well at this stage I hope you’re just trolling and having a good laugh, because if you genuinely can’t see the difference between the uncontested fact that the Nazi party in 1925 had members with membership numbers and the hallucinatory claim that in that year there was a Nazi party cabinet of the Third Reich, I think you may need to find a new hobby. Mccapra (talk) 23:22, 20 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Third Reich NSDAP cabinet 1925. According to the 2nd template; "Feel free to improve the article". In the past 5 days I have made 10 such improvement edits of apx 5000 bytes. My intention is to clarify the article in reference to the deletion discussion.

There are 4 sections of this article. 1. Opening text describing the theme of the article in direct reference to 22 numbers. 2. A block of the 22 numbers, containing the published references by 22 authors who published the 22 numbers, with names allotted to each number. 3. A block of the 22 names (linked to their individual articles), with images. / 4. The 22 section headings containing, my clip notes from the 22 articles of these names. Of these 4 sections, section 4 is already accessible in section 3, and therefore redundant. If I leave section 4 in the article, the clip notes may be expanded to the length of 22 articles! It is my intention to put these clip notes into section 2, for quick, basic references on 22 known individuals, using section 2 for access to fuller details. Section 4, will be used for two new (relevant to section 1) section headings. Reichskanzler' and Bundesrat.

As such, would there be any objection to deleting the 22 redundant section headings, putting the clip notes in 2 block, (what it was created for), and replacing these with the more-relevant Reichskanzler' and Bundesrat sections. If I am not allowed to do this, are there any objections/comments/discussions, to deleting the 22 sections in 4.

I believe that the/my final draft will be self evident, and hopefully acceptable to any critics of my starting draft, and final draft. Any constructive help will be appreciated. Stephen2nd (talk) 20:35, 23 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. The article provides no evidence that anything calling itself the 'Third Reich NSDAP cabinet of 1925' actually existed. A membership list is not a cabinet. AndyTheGrump (talk) 20:49, 23 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I have removed all references to "cabinet", and have started two new sections. I cannot change the title due to these circumstances. This title is obviously redundant. Any advice for a new title for these 22 numbers? Regards Steve.Stephen2nd (talk) 21:20, 23 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
May I propose a new title; NSDAP member list (1 - 24) ?

Stephen2nd (talk) 21:59, 23 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
No, because you have provided absolutely no evidence through sources that 'NSDAP member list (1 - 24)' is a subject meeting Wikipedia notability criteria. AndyTheGrump (talk) 22:26, 23 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Contrary to Goldsztajn above, "I guess the German article being mentioned is which already has an English version." The German list lists NSDAP members (1 - 10m), the English (this Wikipedia) only lists 1000 members, alphabetically. NB: The members (1 - 24) are not on the English Wikipedia. Stephen2nd (talk)

Stephen2nd (talk) 23:02, 23 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Delete This article is nonsense as are the arguments to keep it. Cullen328 (talk) 21:19, 23 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Delete This looks like an obvious delete as it's claims are nonsensical and the editor who made it and is trying to keep it keeps making non-sequitur arguments.--Ermenrich (talk) 22:39, 23 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.