Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The Bishop (Monty Python)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect to List of Monty Python's Flying Circus episodes#4. The Buzz Aldrin Show (or: An Apology). Sandstein 12:20, 1 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The Bishop (Monty Python)

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Wikipedia is not a collection of every sketch Monty Python ever produced. Unlike, say, the Argument Clinic, this article is largely unsourced and basically completely the wrong way to write something on Wikipedia, trying to cover an off-hand silly sketch in serious encyclopedic detail. I'm not convinced about a redirect or merge to any other article (per this discussion), other than retaining a brief entry in Bishop (disambiguation) referring to List of Monty Python's Flying Circus episodes, which doesn't affect this article being deleted. Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 12:52, 15 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Delete: You really got my hopes up with that first blue link. I was hoping there was an essay dedicated specifically to fighting the meticulous cataloging of Monty Python sketches. I guess our own input will have to do. This sketch is not notable for lack of significant, independent coverage. Wikipedia is not TVGuide. Jergling (talk) 20:22, 15 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, no independent notability. Bondegezou (talk) 14:28, 16 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Keep There is significant coverage in sources such as If You Like Monty Python which describes it as "one of their more memorable sketches", Monty Python's Flying Circus and All the bits. The Python oeuvre is covered as extensively as the Bible or Shakespeare and so deletion is quite inappropriate. Andrew D. (talk) 21:22, 17 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Can you give details and add citations to the article if possible? If You Like Monty Python only appears to have one paragraph on it, which hardly satisfies WP:GNG. Bondegezou (talk) 14:00, 18 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  - Well, I could but you'll have to pay for another five minutes. In the meantime, here's a link to a general survey which is worth noting for the next one of these perennial events. The Bishop only seems to make it into the comments but it seems to be somebody's favourite. Andrew D. (talk) 14:47, 18 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The principal difference between this article and Argument Clinic is that the latter cites sources that do not have Monty Python as their main topic, indicating that the sketch is known and talked about independently of its origin, making it a genuinely notable topic for an encyclopedia. Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 16:24, 18 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Genuine notability? Well, I'm afraid we don't get much call for it round these parts, sir. We only have the ordinary sort. With no shrubberies. Andrew D. (talk) 17:25, 18 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Natg 19 (talk) 17:34, 23 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect to List of Monty Python's Flying Circus episodes#4. The Buzz Aldrin Show (or: An Apology) (and by all means add an entry in the disambig page). Even judging by the mentions discovered by Andrew Davidson, I'd maybe expect Monty Python's "most memorable" sketches to have a write up, but not their "more memorable" ones. Despite having watched much Monty Python, this sketch doesn't register to me. Sionk (talk) 20:02, 23 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Question: Surely there is only one Monty Python Sketch which is "Most memorable", even though there might be different opinions as regards which sketch this might be. Thus such a page would require listing the variety of sources which have provided claims for this or that sketch as warranting this title. Although it would be impossible for Wikipedia to definitively determine which sketch actually is the most memorable, we could summarise the evidence and discuss the different methodologies by which the claims have been made. No doubt we might find the odd pedant who argues that as the "most memorable" sketch is essentially unknowable, that in fact all the contenders for the title could only ever be verified as being "more memorable", in that although in principal it might be possible to compare the memorability of individual Monty Python sketches, and thus establish some are more memorable than others, or in fact that all the known sketches are actually more memorable than the unmemorable ones which no-one actually remembers, and thus the matter can simply be resolved by having [[Category:Monty Python sketches]] rather than pusuing a line of enquiry which gets too silly.Leutha (talk) 22:38, 24 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

My cat is now badly confused by that comment. Oooh, thankyou sir, how can we ever repay you? Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 12:33, 28 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect is appropriate here. It really does not meet our notability guidelines. The suggestion that "The Python oeuvre is covered as extensively as the Bible or Shakespeare" is one of the most inappropriate comments that I have ever read. It is indeed pythonese! --Bduke (Discussion) 20:07, 23 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

It really does meet our notability guidelines as I have very little trouble in finding substantial sources. As for the Bible and Shakespeare, please note the extent to which Python pervades our culture here at Wikipedia. I have already mentioned WP:SHRUBBERY while other examples like WP:SPAM and WP:TROUT are used daily here. I don't notice Biblical or Shakespearean references to the same extent but YMMV, I suppose. See also Monty Python, Shakespeare and English Renaissance Drama; The Complete Works of Shakespeare and Monty Python; Uses of Critical Biblical Scholarship and Non-orthodox Views of Jesus in Monty Python's Life of Brian; &c. Andrew D. (talk) 12:41, 28 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Television-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 22:04, 28 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of United Kingdom-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 22:04, 28 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.