Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The Bell

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Merge/redirect with/to Die Glocke. JERRY ^talk _contribs 18:48, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

The Bell

The only source explicitly given as reference is on americanantigravity.com, a site which fails our criteria for reliable sources, compare Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard#"Over-Unity" and "Anti-Gravity". OK, we have articles on strange things and beliefs, provided they are notable enough. But a Google search for witkowski sporrenberg bell, which should match any occurrence of this narrative only returns 27 results, some of them false positives.

The mentioning in two minor works of fiction may add some relevance, but if that would be considered the main reason to keep, the article would have to be turned upside down.

--Pjacobi (talk) 00:46, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Keep I happened to read the nonfiction book The Hunt for Zero Point by Cook -- who is an aerospace editor for Janes, no less -- and The Bell does form a very important part of his work. Exactly what the Nazis were doing may be in dispute, but it was apparently important enough for them to round up and kill every scientist who worked on the project. At any rate, I added -- badly, I do apologize -- a salon.com reference to the Bell in its negative review of Cook's book. I don't believe that Cook, for one, referred to the project by witkowski sporrenberg bell and that may well explain why the nominator's Ghits were so low. I suspect there are slightly different names being used for this thing. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 03:41, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Merge with Die Glocke. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 04:36, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

KEEP -- I've heard of that "bell" on a History Channel program. For what that's worth. Wowest (talk) 05:13, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Conspiracy theories-related deletion discussions. —Shawn in Montreal (talk) 03:50, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions. —Shawn in Montreal (talk) 03:53, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Science-related deletion discussions. —Shawn in Montreal (talk) 03:56, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
• Delete By their very nature paranormal phenomena and conspiracy theories don't exist, so they only reason they can be notable is if the speculation or theory itself is notable. That certainly doesn't seem to be the case here - all of the references are unreliable sources about the alleged German experiments (the cited sources are a book review which is strongly critical of Nick Cook's claims, a blog post and an unreliable website - none these come close to being reliable sources) and there's nothing about the extent to which this particular conspiracy theory has obtained notoriety. --Nick Dowling (talk) 06:44, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

• Keep. Two books about it, references in fiction, and enough cultural diffusion that people "have heard about it." Miami33139 (talk) 07:14, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

• Delete and redirect to the existing article Die Glocke which is more neutral. Unintentional content fork, housekeeping job. Guy (Help!) 11:08, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Neutral? The Die Glocke article describes as Cook as a science fiction writer, which is simply not true. And it calls the device entirely fictional, whereas this article at least describes it as a "supposed" device. IMO, the Die Glocke article is less neutral in these respects. There's also useful content in this article -- for example, the TV doc -- which we wouldn't want to lose. I'd still say a merge and redirect is more in order, with The Bell as the retained article title since this is an English encyclopedia. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 17:50, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

I've corrected Cook's description and changed "fictional" in the Die Glocke lead. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 19:37, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

• Merge with Die Glocke. The two articles are about the same topic. Issues beyond that are editorial issues, not AfD issues. --Stormie (talk) 02:32, 5 January 2008 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.