Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Taliesin Arts Centre

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 17:37, 8 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Taliesin Arts Centre

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I'm not quite sure if this meets ~~WP:NBIO~~WP:NBUILD. It doesn't have any references nor is it of cultural heritage. Tyw7 (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 23:01, 21 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

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Merge with Swansea University. Has not been established that location is notable enough for its own article. ^†Basilosauridae ❯❯❯Talk 23:26, 21 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@Basilosauridae: I agree-- but perhaps delete is better, as the Egypt centre is already at Egypt Centre, Swansea University. ThatMontrealIP (talk) 20:26, 26 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Visual arts-related deletion discussions. Tyw7 (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 23:40, 21 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Coverage in GNews appears to satisfy GNG. Has, amongst other things, the largest museum of Ancient Egypt in Wales: [1]. That is an important collection. James500 (talk) 14:04, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@James500: Already included on wiki at Egypt Centre, Swansea University.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 20:27, 26 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Egypt Centre, Swansea University is a redirect which does not include anything. James500 (talk) 00:04, 27 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Actually it is a redirect that leads to a section in the Swansea University article on the Egypt collection.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 01:24, 27 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: appears to be a somewhat significant cultural institution. There's some coverage, such as in this guidebook [2]:

On site is an imaginative performance space, the Taliesin Arts Centre, which also incorporates the Ceri Richards Gallery, specializing in touring exhibitions by contemporary Welsh and Celtic artists. Also housed here, the Egypt Centre is...

I believe this is sufficient for a stub that can be improved. K.e.coffman (talk) 19:17, 25 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

K.e.coffman, but the building itself does not have a cultural heritage. It just houses the Egyptian Center. --Tyw7 (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 20:04, 25 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Arts centres can be notable for the collections they contain, or these collections at least contribute to notability. This appears to be the case here, hence my "keep" vote. K.e.coffman (talk) 20:33, 25 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Guidebooks are promotional materials and are not considered reliable sources on Wikipedia. If this location is notable there should be reliable secondary sources, but I haven’t seen any. ^†Basilosauridae ❯❯❯Talk 01:11, 27 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Delete The only thing notable here is the Egypt collection, which is already covered at Egypt Centre, Swansea University. The building is not notable by inheriting the collection. ThatMontrealIP (talk) 20:22, 26 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- Egypt Centre, Swansea University is a redirect which does not cover anything. There is some content at the Swansea University article, but that should be spun out to the arts centre. It is also worth bearing in mind that the arts centre has other things beside the Egypt Collection. Quite a lot of things. James500 (talk) 00:04, 27 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  - Egypt Centre, Swansea University redirects to a two-page succinct description of the Eqypt collection, and two-word mention of the Taliesen centre. Re: "Quite a lot of Things", could you be a bit more vague? Seriously now, do you have sources for the "quite a lot of things"? Because so far all we have is a heartfelt belief that it's notable, and one source in a guidebook. The Taliesin centre's notability is very adequately covered by the Egypt Centre, Swansea University redirect. ThatMontrealIP (talk) 01:19, 27 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
    - The description of the Egypt Centre in the Swansea University article is not succinct, it is completely inadequate and needs major expansion. James500 (talk) 14:13, 27 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
    - I have pointed out that there are other sources in GNews: [3] (which yields about seventy-odd relevant sources) [4] [5]. Likewise with searches for "egypt centre"+swansea: [6] [7] [8]. Are you unable to see those sources? James500 (talk) 14:09, 27 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  James500, like what other things? There's a cafe upstairs and a theater room. There is also a bookshop. Not quite sure if the bank is still running or not. I am a student at Swansea University.
  
  Taliesin Annex is a lecture theater.
  
  Oh and then there's the Egyptian exhibit.
  
  That's pretty much it. See https://www.taliesinartscentre.co.uk/en/your-visit --Tyw7 (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 01:43, 27 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  - "Other things": I was referring to the theatre, cinema [9] [10] [11] and art gallery [12] [13]. That is quite a lot of other things. Theatres and galleries have their own productions and exhibitions, which attract coverage eg [14]. James500 (talk) 13:53, 27 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

James500, the sources you gave are not SIGCOV of the theatre, they are about things that happen in it. none of them go into coverage in-depth. The last one you give above is about a play, not about the theatre itself. As User:Tyw7, a student of the university where the theatre is locate says, there is nothing notable about the building itself. Notability is WP:NOTINHERITED: when finding sources we need sources that actually talk about the subject in depth, not just sources that say something a play was staged there. Do you have any of those? ThatMontrealIP (talk) 04:32, 30 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Keep, merge, or delete?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, SkyGazer 512 ^{Oh no, what did I do this time?} 01:42, 29 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Keep, on the basis it is one of the top major arts venues in the city, as evidenced by the various coverage with Wales Online in particular. But even the BBC's summary of the contenders to the UK City of Culture mentions only three Swansea venues - Glyn Vivian, Grand Theatre and the Taliesin Arts Centre. It's clearly far more than just part of the Swansea University site. Of course, if the Centre houses an important Egypt collection this should be covered in the article. Additionally the closure of the Centre's "renowned" art gallery in 2017 received quite a bit of coverage. Sionk (talk) 03:58, 30 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Keep, per Sionk and others above. Museums open to the public are usually notable. This is apparently a museum, per above, i.e. it has a collection, though that is not reflected yet in the article, which makes it appear to be just a performance space. --Doncram (talk) 03:27, 31 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Doncram, well actually it isn't actually a museum per se but it houses a small collection. However, it's main function is of a movie / performance theater --Tyw7 (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 04:28, 31 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Keep An arts center that had been around for decades. Houses a museum of Ancient Egypt (accredited), and is an active performing arts center that stages its own productions and hosts touring groups. WP:HEY, I added a few profile/feature stories aobut the Centre from regional and local press. E.M.Gregory (talk) 10:31, 2 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Keep No need for me to rehash the arguments made by others, there is enough coverage in RSs to make it notable. Edwardx (talk) 11:01, 2 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Can you clarify which RSs you are referring to? I haven't seen any RSs that establish notability. One line in an article stating it exists doesn't establish notability. ^†Basilosauridae ❯❯❯Talk 16:00, 2 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I added 4 such sources to the article yesterday, User:Basilosauridae, it's sort of useful to check what sourcing is on the page before making statements like this.E.M.Gregory (talk) 16:34, 3 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Pinging Edwardx to draw their attention. --Tyw7 (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 22:49, 2 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note that when a cultural institution has been around for several decades, and has a building, it's a really good idea to at least click "books" on the search bar. Unsurprisingly, this brings up a few that seem to be mere mentions, and a description in a guide book to British colleges, but also Modern Playhouses: An Architectural History of Britain's New Theatres, 1945 — 1985 an Oxford University Press book from which the architects who designed it can be sourced.E.M.Gregory (talk) 16:43, 3 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.