Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/So You Think You Can Dance (American season 16) Top Ten finalists

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Vanamonde (Talk) 04:58, 26 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

So You Think You Can Dance (American season 16) Top Ten finalists[edit]

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Poorly sourced content fork of dubious necessity; it is not at all clear that this needs to be a separate article from the main So You Think You Can Dance (American season 16). While it is true that a couple of the early seasons have standalone contestant lists separately from the season articles, they mostly feature poorly sourced deep trivia that wouldn't even be kept in standalone BLPs if these people qualified for those -- separate contestant lists literally haven't existed since Season 6, with consensus having shifted toward keeping the contestant lists in the main season article rather than spinning them off as separate articles, and the only reason that even S2 through S6 still have standalone lists is a lack of editor commitment to actually cleaning up all the unencyclopedic bumf in them. This is cruft, not a model we should be reviving for the current season after having deprecated it for a full decade. Even the referencing here is mostly unreliable junk like Meaww and Goldderby and/or routine "local kid gets on reality show" coverage in the contestants' hometown local newspapers, not reliable or notability-making sources about the show. Bearcat (talk) 01:25, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Dance-related deletion discussions. Bearcat (talk) 01:25, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Television-related deletion discussions. Bearcat (talk) 01:25, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Keep in some form, obviously. It was deleted twice from the main article where I had put it some this seemed like the best place to house it. Obviously adding to each bio will take time. As each will be getting media coverage as a top ten finalist the article will grow. If there is a better place to house these bios I’m open. Gleeanon409 (talk) 01:40, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

If the contestants are not yet notable enough for their own standalone BLPs (which they're not, so don't take this as a license to try), then why do we need to create or maintain extended minibios of them, in either the season article or a standalone minibio compilation like this, at all? Bearcat (talk) 16:58, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I was looking to start a few of the bios, Eddie Hoyt’s for one, but I was having Internet connectivity issues and also working on Rainbow Honor Walk, so put it off for the moment. Gleeanon409 (talk) 17:27, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

People are not automatically eligible for BLPs just for being competitors in a reality show. The person who wins the season in the finale is the only one who gets an article because of SYTYCD itself; anybody else who competed but didn't win still has to build their notability the same way a dancer who was never on the show at all has to, namely by continuing to work as a dancer and/or choreographer and achieving something that would get them over our notability standards for dancers or choreographers. Bearcat (talk) 18:27, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I was just going by WP:GNG. This was the step to see which would have their own articles. The show itself feeds out biographical content every show in its aired video packages. Just like American Idol, America’s Got Talent, etc. Gleeanon409 (talk) 18:52, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The show is not an independent source for the purposes of establishing the standalone notability of its contestants; it is a directly affiliated source. Just like American Idol, America's Got Talent, etc.: their non-winning competitors don't automatically get Wikipedia articles just for being non-winning competitors on a reality show either, but also have to establish their notability the regular way by achieving something more notable in their continued careers after the show. Brian Justin Crum got an article because he had an actual charting hit that got him over NMUSIC, not because he was on AGT; D.J. Demers got an article when he scored a Juno Award nomination for a comedy album, not because he was on AGT in and of itself; Jennifer Hudson got an article when she was in Dreamgirls and became a major movie and music star who now cleared NACTOR and NMUSIC, not because she was on AI. They don't have articles because they were on reality shows and lost; they have articles because they kept working, and went on to achieve something more notable, after their non-winning runs on reality shows ended. Bearcat (talk) 19:10, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I’m not sure why you’re talking past me? I never suggested these finalists were notable because they were a finalist. I started compiling these to see if any did meet WP:GNG before creating their articles. Gleeanon409 (talk) 19:33, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

In the remarkably rare event that a non-winning competitor in a reality show somehow already clears GNG on coverage already received before they were even on the show, that'll be immediately apparent without needing an article like this to exist as a premature placeholder — in fact, if a person is actually in that situation, then there's already a significant probability that their article already exists. Bearcat (talk) 19:38, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

This was created in the main article where I think it belongs. Only after an anon deleted it, and I saw at least five other identical articles did I chose this option. Gleeanon409 (talk) 19:48, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Completely unneeded fork; this should stay in So You Think You Can Dance (American season 16) in whatever form is WP:TV-appropriate, and we don't need to carbon-copy fox.com/sytycd for biographical information. Nate • (chatter) 06:53, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- I’ve never even seen Fox.com/sytycd. Gleeanon409 (talk) 16:35, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  - You're enough of a fan of the show to think we need an article like this, but you've never gone to the show's own primary website at all? Seems unlikely somehow. Bearcat (talk) 17:05, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    - I’d be willing to bet the far majority of people who watch shows never visit their websites. No, I never have, despite your suspicion. Gleeanon409 (talk) 17:27, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - if you couldn't gain the consensus in the article for its inclusion maybe there was a reason why. Absolutely no reason to have this split off. --Gonnym (talk) 10:09, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- It was one anon. Gleeanon409 (talk) 16:35, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Delete or Merge - Definitely does not need its own article. Foxnpichu (talk) 12:27, 19 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - looks like a repeat of information largely already in So You Think You Can Dance (American season 16) - Overlistification, WP:LISTCRUFT - Epinoia (talk) 00:20, 26 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.