Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Scorpion (Marvel Comics)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect to Scorpion (disambiguation)#Comics. Numerically, this is 8 for keeping versus 10 for deleting/redirecting, but of the 8 at least one makes it clear they wish to keep this as an index, rather than a content page, and a couple of other !votes are ambiguous. I read the first of these as at least partially supporting redirecting, as there isn't an obvious basis in policy for preferring multiple DAB pages over a single one. Furthermore, the concerns (directly stated or implied) about this not being a coherent topic for a standalone page haven't really been rebutted, and the two clearly notable characters here have standalone pages; I'm not seeing a clearly stated argument for why a standalone content page is necessary over and above those two. As such I find the arguments to "keep" somewhat weaker, and this tips consensus toward redirecting. Vanamonde (Talk) 23:11, 12 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Scorpion (Marvel Comics)

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One of those weirdly overgrown disambis/lists ("The Scorpion is the name of multiple characters in Marvel Comics"). The problem, as usual, is that none of those multiple characters appear notable. References are short mentions or plot summaries or straight-up links to comic books. Perhaps redirect to Mac Gargan (article claims he is the best known of those characters)? _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 08:10, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Fictional elements, Science fiction and fantasy, and Comics and animation. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 08:10, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - Let this page stay. This was established as a set index article to list other characters who are named Scorpion....especially the version seen in the Ultimate Spider-Man TV series that had no mentioning of him being Mac Gargan and the one of Spider-Man's clones from the Ultimate Marvel version of the "Clone Saga". Otherwise, merge with List of Marvel Comics characters: S in the spirit of WP:PRESERVE while transferring Scorpia's information to her section there since a previous AFD about Scorpia had her redirected to this page in the first place. --Rtkat3 (talk) 01:04, 12 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
If this is supposed to be a disambiguation, it needs to be pruned to a few bullet points lists. It has mutated way beyond what a disambig should ever be. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 05:31, 15 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - I think this could be salvaged, with severe pruning. Listing these characters on the Scorpion (disambiguation) page doesn't make sense, and neither does tossing them all into a List of Marvel characters where a reader would have a harder time locating the one they want to learn about. The fictional content should all be reduced, the "other versions" should just be mixed in with the 616 versions, since these are all "other" versions of the Scorpion, and the "in other media" should be almost entirely scrapped as a fork from Mac Gargan, with the exception of the non-Mac Gargan Scorpion from the Spider-Verse film. I'd be happy to make these edits, but I don't want to waste the effort if others feel it would still merit deletion. Argento Surfer (talk) 13:02, 12 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- While some of the Spider-Man clones from the Ultimate Marvel version of the "Clone Saga" have their own pages, how would you recommend handling the clone that became Scorpion since that version predated Maximus Gargan? Kron Stone already redirects to the List of Marvel Comics characters: S page as a version of him was also 2099's version of Venom. --Rtkat3 (talk) 15:42, 12 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  - I would list them all alphabetically and include their creators and first appearance under their section. The clone would be listed under "Peter Parker (clone)." Argento Surfer (talk) 16:40, 12 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Per above.★Trekker (talk) 14:48, 12 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to the disambiguation page Scorpion (disambiguation)#Comics, as non-notable on its own but a valid disambiguation for multiple Marvel characters. We just don't need an entire article summarizing them, that fails GNG. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 12:41, 14 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- Note that only 2 of the characters are currently mentioned at your proposed target. Are you suggesting the others aren't worth including anywhere? Argento Surfer (talk) 12:39, 15 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  They could be added there if they'd be mentione somewhere else where we could pipe a redirect, like the usual lists of Mervel Comic characters, so no loss for the search engine. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 13:17, 15 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to disambiguation per Zxcvbnm. Agree that this is WP:OR about many different characters who happen to share the same name. There is already a disambiguation page for this where people can read much better articles about the individual characters. Would also support redirecting to the most notable of those characters. Shooterwalker (talk) 17:24, 14 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Disambiguations-related deletion discussions. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 05:31, 15 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per Argento Surfer. BOZ (talk) 21:17, 15 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Scorpion (disambiguation)#Comics, it's not as if that particular page is overflowing with so many names it needs to be split, if there is stuff in this mess that merits a mention there it can be merged from the article history. Devonian Wombat (talk) 09:00, 16 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting, divided between those advocating Keep and those who want a Redirect
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 08:08, 18 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Delete or redirect per nom. The disambiguation page allows people to navigate to better constructed articles. Cobbling together several different topics is WP:OR and incompatible with a reliable Wikipedia article. Jontesta (talk) 00:00, 20 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Keep as notability exists. Though the option to redirect can be still entertained on talk page. CharlesWain (talk) 11:29, 23 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 17:22, 26 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect to Mac Gargan for consensus. Any expansion can continue there as these are really the same character, but that article needs some clean-up too. Archrogue (talk) 20:09, 2 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect - Nothing shows that the grouping or minor members of the grouping establish notability. This provides no particular utility over a more succinct, normal disambig. TTN (talk) 20:30, 2 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Scorpion (disambiguation)#Comics - As there are two distinct versions that currently have their own articles, this would be the proper target for the Redirect. If any of the other characters mentioned here are deemed notable enough for a mention, they can be added as a note to that disambiguation, but I honestly don't believe any of them to be. Rorshacma (talk) 18:06, 3 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- Would you prefer that the version of Scorpion that is a clone of Peter Parker from Ultimate Marvel have it's information be transferred to List of Marvel Comics characters: S as @Argento Surfer: has proposed. --Rtkat3 (talk) 01:09, 11 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Final relist, still divided among editors whether to Keep or Redirect this article (and two different redirect targets have support).
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:06, 3 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I am fine with redirecting to Scorpion (disambiguation)#Comics. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 04:16, 11 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Keep per Argento Surfer TITANOSAURUS 05:20, 11 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per Argento Surfer. Dark knight 2149 14:14, 11 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Scorpion (disambiguation)#Comics. Per Rorshacma. Elbatli (talk) 20:52, 11 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Scorpion (disambiguation)#Comics. The content and topic fail WP:NOTPLOT, and the "keep" opinions fail to establish the topic's notability throuch substantial coverage in reliable sources. Sandstein 09:14, 12 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Delete (or redirect, merge) Just media appearances and plot information, no WP:GNG source in sight, no indication of real-world significance. Avilich (talk) 22:40, 12 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.