Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Party Minister of the NSDAP

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect‎ to Last will and testament of Adolf Hitler. ✗plicit 14:46, 20 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Party Minister of the NSDAP[edit]

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I redirected this to Last will and testament of Adolf Hitler, but was reverted by the article creator because (like they said on my user talk page) "The Position still held power and was extremely important within Germany". In reality, the position was nominally held by one person, had no influence whatsoever, and more importantly as a consequence isn't notable enough to warrant a separate page. Fram (talk) 13:20, 13 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: History, Military, Politics, and Germany. Fram (talk) 13:20, 13 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The position was quite literally able to appoint the highest position within the Reich, a Reichsleiter. The position still operated within it's capacity officially in stead of Hitler, as Goerring and Himmler were both declared traitors. Kecesi (talk) 13:26, 13 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Furthermore, the page you redirected to had no information what so ever of the Party Minister position, to people who don't know the history of the Third Reich the position may be insignificant but it operated as essentially Fuhrer after Hitler's Death. Kecesi (talk) 13:30, 13 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The position also appointed Gauleiters which were the Party leaders for designated Regions who also held authority over their own individual Volksstrum units. Kecesi (talk) 13:37, 13 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

One last note Anwärter has it's own Wikipedia Page, there's a clear precedent set that a position that held the power to appoint a Reichsleiter, a position that only answers to the Fuhrer is relevant. Kecesi (talk) 20:28, 13 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect per nominee for the reasons stated. I understand the importance of the position but just one person held it.

--A. B. ^{(talk • contribs • global count)} 03:32, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sure however, this was towards the end of the war and it held power over all the Gauleiters which also held power over their individual volksstrum units, not to mention this fed into the late war Himmler x Bormann Power Struggle. Kecesi (talk) 14:48, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect, per nom. Also, agree not notable enough for a stand alone article, which in a practical sense would never be more than a stub, at best. Kierzek (talk) 04:15, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
You can say that and I respect it however, this just leads me to believe that you're ignoring the late war contributions as it still held power over all the Volksstrum, acted as de-facto Fuhrer and could appoint and remove Reichsleiters essentially giving the position Fuhrer-prinzip which was excersized. Kecesi (talk) 14:50, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
It's also received independent coverage than from Hitler's Testament and hence my belief. Kecesi (talk) 14:54, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
There's also transcripts of how it influenced the Volksstrum. Kecesi (talk) 14:58, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Kecesi, I think the difference between your point of view and others’ here is summed up in the pronouns “it” and “he”. You see “it”, we see “him”.

—A. B. ^{(talk • contribs • global count)} 15:06, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Various Positions which were only held by one person have their own Wikipedia pages, there's a clear precedent that positions will extremely high amounts of power and importance even if held by one person can have their own article with relevant information Kecesi (talk) 15:19, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Mind you this is a Minister Position WITH Portfolio as well, we cover the Reich Forest Master Position and it has it's own Article I don't see how this is relevant. Kecesi (talk) 15:27, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Seems like the Article was Reviewed does this mean it's suitable for Inclusion like Wikipedia states? Articles considered suitable for inclusion are marked as 'reviewed'? My apologies I'm a little confused. Kecesi (talk) 16:14, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

No, when an article is nominated for deletion (at AfD, like here), it gets automatically tagged as "reviewed": other reviewers don't need to check it, as it is already at a community discussion which will decide if it can stay or not (or gets redirected). Fram (talk) 16:19, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Alright, thanks. Kecesi (talk) 16:27, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect: The power that this ministerial position had was largely hypothetical, and power alone doesn't infer notability. Unless this has received independent coverage from Hitler's testament, redirect there.
Redirect: Agree with all of above, no value add with this page. Marleeashton (talk) 04:22, 15 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The Powers of the Position will be further clarified, the Roll it played towards the end of the War is clarified as well. I simply don't believe you've read the articles you want to redirect to. Kecesi (talk) 17:20, 16 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect per nom and others. The position was more an expression of Hitler's final delusions than an actual, functional office. Intothat darkness 15:41, 17 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I'd understand this if it held no power but for quite a bit of time it still acted to appoint Gauleiters and Reichsleiters not to mention that Gauleiters held immense control over their Volksstrum units. Kecesi (talk) 23:39, 17 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Except there is no indication that such appointments by Bormann took place. Curbon7 (talk) 00:05, 18 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Exactly. There's no indication any of this existed anywhere other than in Hitler's mind. Considering this was signed in 29 April and Doenitz ordered military operations to cease on 7 May (and Bormann was likely killed on 2 May trying to flee the bunker/Berlin), any power this position might have exerted existed for no more than 8 days (more likely three or four at most given Bormann's demise). Intothat darkness 00:44, 19 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
There is documentation of the Powers for the Parteiminister, not to mention the fact that the Ministerial Portfolio was quite literally the Party. Kecesi (talk) 17:14, 19 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

There are Telegrams and Transcripts of this power being utilized. Kecesi (talk) 17:15, 19 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.