Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Our Lady of Lourdes Catholic Church (Raleigh, North Carolina)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Speedy delete - G12 (non-admin closure). Whpq (talk) 17:46, 12 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Our Lady of Lourdes Catholic Church (Raleigh, North Carolina)[edit]

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Long-established precedent says that elementary and middle schools are not worthy of inclusion. Relevant merge target is Roman Catholic Diocese of Raleigh Purpleback pack 89≈≈≈≈ 14:17, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Also WP:COPYVIO problems. Here, the article was tagged as a copyvio. Looking at the revision history since then, we find that the text of the body hasn't changed significantly since then Purpleback pack 89≈≈≈≈ 14:30, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of North Carolina-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:32, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Christianity-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:33, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Schools-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:33, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - This is a tricky one, as it includes both a church and primary school. Since the article title relates to the church, not the primary school, a lower notability bar is called for, in my view. The copyvio aspect, if verified, would be cause for immediate deletion of the article, of course. However, it appears that the original history from which this piece may (or may not) have been originally pulled is now down. It would take some Time Machine detective work to provide such a diff. My own inclination is to let this one stand and move along. Carrite (talk) 17:04, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Keep I have a feeling the sourcing can be found on this church and that is likely has historical significance. As part of a mass nomination of related articles I don't think this nomination should be given much weight as its unlikely much research into each item was done to determine the likelihood or sources or notability.LuciferWildCat (talk) 18:36, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

This is not the best way to participate in deletion discussions. Aside from the "I have a feeling that sources exist," please read WP:ADHOM and avoid voting on the basis of a nominator's actions. St Anselm (talk) 00:11, 8 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Comment The precedent about the elementary/middle schools doesn't mean we automatically delete them if they pop up without looking into it. It just means that they aren't generally given the benefit of the doubt like high schools are. the e/m schools have to prove real notability. Also, like stated above, this article is more about the church than the school. If it is part of simply a mass deletion nomination, I also am a little leery of that. However, that said, I am having trouble finding third-party sources that prove notability (or any historical significance as mentioned above) for either subject. Only apparent possible claim to notability for the school is its Blue Ribbon status. Will keep looking, but I'm leaning closer to saying merge. Definitely think it needs rescue with third-party sources. -- JoannaSerah (talk) 19:35, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

What about the COPYVIO concerns? Purpleback pack 89≈≈≈≈ 19:41, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I hadn't looked into that, yet, since I was first trying to find 3P sources to improve the article. You're right. The history section still reads almost exactly like the church's website. Just very minor, token punctuation changes, etc. I would consider that section COPYVIO, maybe not whole article though. Taking that section out as copyvio would lend even more weight to merge/redirect -- JoannaSerah (talk) 20:39, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Delete No sources have been provided to satisfy WP:ORG. Several individual nominations of similar subjects are not what I think of as a "mass nomination," which would be one AFD directed at multiple articles. Churches certainly do not enjoy a presumption of notability like high schools, and most articles about individual congregations have been deleted in AFDs. Edison (talk) 21:40, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect/Merge to locality or school governing body per longstanding consensus. I'm also expressing concern with the large numbers of school nominations at the moment; it can't be expected that all editors be able to respond to this mass act of deletionist ideology. ˜danjel [ talk | contribs ] 23:45, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Merge to Roman Catholic Diocese of Raleigh. No claim of notability, lacks significant coverage in 3rd party sources. Primary school doesn't help provide much in the way of notability either. Blue Ribbon School title isn't very notable either as those aren't hard to come by. RadioFan (talk) 01:17, 8 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect (blank, and merge any useful content) to Roman Catholic Diocese of Raleigh per nominator's own suggestion. Non notable schools are generally not deleted; instead, as demonstrated by 100s of AfD closures, they are redirected to the article about the school district (USA) or to the article about the locality (rest of the world). --Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 15:39, 9 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

NOTE for closer: if this AfD is closed as 'redirect', please remember to include the {{R from school}} template on the redirect page. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 15:39, 9 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Google news search for "Our Lady of Lourdes Catholic Church" And "Raleigh" to make certain I got the right one, shows over 500 results. [1] Remove -funeral and -weddings from it, and that lowers it down to a few dozen. I don't see anything in those though other than saying people who died belonged to that church. Note that Wikipedia does NOT have precedents. Each case is different. Dream Focus 23:21, 10 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy delete G12 As some users have noted, Our Lady of Lourdes Catholic Church (Raleigh, North Carolina)#History of church and school has been copied from the church's website with very minor changes. Most of the prose has been copied from the pages cited as refs. (The OLLS Sports site is down.) The article's creator Nctennishco12 was blocked for sockpuppetry, and the master Tarheelz123 was originally blocked for creating copyright violations. I have tagged the article CSD G12. Flatscan (talk) 05:09, 12 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Deleted as G12, copyvio speedy deletion. Kindly note that AFD is precedent; WP:OTHERSTUFF does not apply here, because closed AFDs are the result of consensus, not simply the creation of a single editor like random Pokémons were before they were sent to AFD. Nyttend (talk) 05:55, 12 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.