Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Palestinian suicide attacks (2nd nomination)

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep‎. I see a consensus to Keep this article. Liz Read! Talk! 21:28, 24 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

List of Palestinian suicide attacks[edit]

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List of Palestinian suicide attacks (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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This list is a mixture of unsourced and unverified information. Most of the entries are uncited, and most of the entries are red linked, leaving it unclear if pages were created for these events and deleted for want of notability, or simply never created in the first place for want of notability. (NB: Red links since cleaned up.) Any notable or significantly covered events will have found a home in the year-by-year timelines at Template:Timeline of the Israeli–Palestinian conflict, which is the appropriate place for them, and where they are better contextualized in the conflict in a manner that does not simply present one-side of a two-way street. Iskandar323 (talk) 18:08, 17 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete - for all the reasons mentioned above. And also because the list creator is a confirmed sock master with 119 confirmed sock puppets.(Category:Wikipedia sockpuppets of AndresHerutJaim) — Maile (talk) 02:26, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
    Keep The fact that the creator is a sock master is irrelevant if the topic is notable enough for inclusion (see W:NOTESAL). If Obama's article was created by AndresHerutJaim, would you nominate it for deletion as well? Don't delete an article because you disagree with its contents. EytanMelech (talk) 11:21, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - Suicide Attacks during the Israeli-Palestinian conflict are a notable and unique facet of the conflict that have warranted a massive amount of specific and separate attention by the news media and academia. (See ref box below) The attacks are considered a standout element of the conflict, and the fact that this page has remained more or less unbothered by deletion claims since 2009 I think not only points toward a silent consensus of the page’s relevance, but as well points a critical eye at the small group of editors who have surreptitiously attempted to either modify linked pages (seemingly on non-neutral political grounds), or have the entire page deleted to bury the lede on the matter entirely.
To rebut the assertions made in the deletion request:
This list is a mixture of unsourced and unverified information. Most of the entries are uncited
  • The list of suicide bombings in the conflict is well covered and documented in both news media and academia. For this reason alone, there have been no vocal or consistent concerns on the page regarding verification. There are already sources in the page that cover the master list of attacks, and pulling citations for each individual attack is just a matter of putting the work in.
most of the entries are red linked, leaving it unclear if pages were created for these events and deleted for want of notability, or simply never created in the first place for want of notability.
  • Thank you for noting that red links have been cleaned up already. I disagree with the charged interpretation of these red links. It merely appears that an earlier page editor either mistakenly believed certain page articles were pre-existing, or intended on returning to the page to create those articles. Regardless, all major incidences of violence during the I/P conflict (most especially suicide attacks) are well covered in media, and if individual articles need be created to push the issue of notability, that won’t be an issue. It’s just a matter of putting the work in.
Any notable or significantly covered events will have found a home in the year-by-year timelines at Template:Timeline of the Israeli–Palestinian conflict, which is the appropriate place for them
  • Disagree. Suicide attacks are too unique a phenomena that warrants detailed information and analysis to only reside in a generic conflict timeline.
…where they are better contextualized in the conflict in a manner that does not simply present one-side of a two-way street
  • Disagree. Assembling a list of categorically similar events (that represent a distinct and unique conflict trend with a beginning and end date) does not in any way present a one-sided view of the conflict. Here’s where I’m confused. This deletion request was made alongside deletion requests for Civilian casualties in the Second Intifada, which includes Palestinian casualties.
While I agree that these articles need a great amount of clean-up and citation work (and also agree with your WP:NOTMEMORIAL assertions - which can be addressed with the removal of victim names, not the entire article), I’m not sure how the triple deletion of these pages helps ease any perception of one-sided treatment of elements of the conflict.
Mistamystery (talk) 07:08, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Refs:
[1]https://www.rand.org/pubs/reprints/RP1187.html
[2]https://nasmhpd.org/sites/default/files/Suicide%20Terrorism%20sheehan-are-suicide-terrorist-suicidal-a-critical-assessment-of-the-evidence.pdf
[3]https://academic.oup.com/book/10950/chapter-abstract/159242218?redirectedFrom=fulltext
[4]https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257/jep.21.3.223
[5]https://encompass.eku.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1172&context=etd
[6]https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/10.1146/annurev-polisci-062813-051049
[7]https://www.jstor.org/stable/20203051
[8]https://repository.library.georgetown.edu/handle/10822/553419
[9]https://read.dukeupress.edu/south-atlantic-quarterly/article-abstract/112/1/99/3642/The-Fanonian-Specter-in-Palestine-Suicide-Bombing?redirectedFrom=fulltext
[10]https://www.ojp.gov/ncjrs/virtual-library/abstracts/suicide-bombing-strategy-and-interaction-case-second-intifada Mistamystery (talk) 07:08, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Strong keep - Important information documenting suicide attacks, a characteristic feature of Palestinian terrorism. It's useful to have a list mentioning suicide attacks by year and casualties, just like for rocket attacks per year. In addition, before this article there were several others with more specific 'List of Hamas suicide attacks', 'List of Islamic Jihad suicide attacks', 'List of Fatah suicide attacks', etc. It wasn't created by some sockpuppet back in 2006 or so. Rather than deleting the article under spurious excuses (such as claiming there are no sources when they are all in external links), we should improve it. Dovidroth (talk) 07:31, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Per WP:NOTESAL Notability of lists ... is based on the group. One accepted reason why a list topic is considered notable is if it has been discussed as a group or set by independent reliable sources. This topic has been discussed a lot by independent reliable sources. Alaexis¿question? 08:10, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Strong keep. Palestinian suicide attacks have been much-discussed in reliable secondary sources. The list could use more sources, but it should not be deleted. Zanahary (talk) 13:03, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep. All keep-sayers above made valid points. Although I wouldn't say suicide attacks are unique to Palestinians attacking Israelis. Has become characteristic over the years probably describes the situation better. gidonb (talk) 06:00, 19 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep. Per WP:NOTESAL, as previously noted by User:Alaexis. I even believe a Suicide bombings in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict article is warranted to provide greater depth and context, given the extensive scholarly research and analysis on the topic. The article needs some work but there are no valid grounds for its deletion. Mooonswimmer 15:06, 19 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep. Obviously notable. G5 does not apply if there are significant edits by other editors, which there are. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Closetside (talk • contribs) 15:30, 22 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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