Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Leona Graham

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Nomination Withdrawn per below. UltraExactZZ Said ~ Did 15:30, 27 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Leona Graham[edit]

Leona Graham (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)
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There do not appear to be substantial third party sources, despite efforts of other editor to find such sources. So, notability isn't established. There's no good basis to write a neutral article, since the sources are not neutral. Rob (talk) 20:08, 24 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The efforts of a single day cannot be the basis for this nomination. I have completely rewritten the article, removed the original contents and tried to find sources. Instead of helping me in my efforts to turn this into a useful article, you nominate it for deletion, not even hours after I've written the article. I contest the decision to nominate the article for deletion since this would require Wikipedia to delete almost all related articles in the Absolute Radio section as well. M.wernicke (talk) 20:13, 24 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Some examples for the articles of her colleagues at Absolute Radio:

Sarah Champion = 0 references Christian O'Connell = no references regarding his career or personal life, most sections without any references at all Nick Jackson = no references regarding the stations he has worked for (O 106, BRMB, Heart FM etc.) M.wernicke (talk) 20:27, 24 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]


I would like the requester to outline which sections violate the guidelines and to what extend for these individual sections further sources should be added. I have a genuine interest in improving this article and I would appreciate any possible help. M.wernicke (talk) 21:29, 24 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete - per nom. A quick look at the current references:
    • Biography on debretts.com
Site with no real reason to be considered authoritive. Has "biographies" of over twenty five thousand people in the UK alone, it states that "The focus of the editors has always been on making People of Today as meritocratic and contemporary as possible. We are strong in our coverage of the younger professions such as the media, and we count among our entrants the increasing number of celebrity chefs, up-and-coming actors and pop stars. We pride ourselves on recognising early success as well as lifetime achievement. This is made possible by the fact that it is our policy to remove entrants who no longer fulfil our criteria.." [1] which is great, but Wikipedia doesn't do articles on people that may one day require deletion.
    • Blog entry "A Brief History of Virgin Radio by Adam Bowie" at One Golden Square
Blog post on non-notable site that only states "In April, Leona Graham joined the station, taking over from Gail Porter who had been covering weekend evenings." Seems to be another trivial mention from a primary source.
    • Leona Graham's profile on Absolute Radio's website
    • Leona Graham's biography on her official website
Both of these are primary sources and do not establish notability.
    • The Independent of 22 August 2005 regarding her involvement with Radio Warwick
Lists of radio station which lists her in a sub-list of participants on a single radio station's listing. This would be trivial for the station, certainly for her.
    • Trewin, Janet (2003). "Presenting on TV and radio: an insider's guide", Focal Press.
Not a link, cannot evaluate.
    • Leona Graham's professional profile and CV at Linkedin
    • Radio career on Leona Graham's official website
Primary sources
    • The Guardian, June 7th, 2004: "Music fades for Virgin DJs"
Yet another trivial mention: "Leona Graham is taking over the Saturday breakfast show"
    • Schedule on LeonaGraham.org
Primary Source
    • The Times Online of August 1st, 2008: People: Tony Blair, Gillian Anderson, Alice Cooper and Katie Price
Trivial mention "Alice Cooper tells Leona Graham on Virgin Radio that criticism of his band by Mary Whitehouse"
    • List of recent audio and video interviews
    • Voiceovers section on her professional website
    • rhubarb.co.uk artist page for Leona Graham
Primary Sources
    • 2010 Sony Radio Academy Awards, category "Best Station Imaging"
Trivial mention, one of many names on that page
    • Blog post regarding Absolute Radio's nominations at the 2010 Sony Radio Academy Awards
Primary source

These sources clearly do not establish notability. WikiManOne (talk) 23:50, 24 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

  • Do Not Delete

Most sources are used as reference just for a single fact, like "She joined in 2000" or "She worked at Radio Warwick" or "She did the breakfast show" or "Absolute won an Award" or "She did an interview with Brian Johnson". And to establish that it is unnecessary to find a whole article explaining that in 300 words. If you applied your principles to the remaining articles in the "Absolute Radio DJs" section, almost all of them would have to be deleted as these articles usually do not have any notable references at all. M.wernicke (talk) 07:14, 25 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - The issue is not whether the claims in the article are true or not, the issue here is whether she is notable, and the citations do not (seem to) show that per WP:ENT. Also, the fact that similar articles exist is not a argument to keep any article per WP:OTHERCRAP. WikiManOne (talk) 08:04, 25 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Thank you, WikiManOne, for responding. I did believe until now that references exist mainly to provide prove for facts mentioned in the article. If that is not their primary function, then maybe I did it all wrong. As I was explaining before, I have re-written the article in an effort to prevent its deletion, as before it has been said that it lacked notability solely because of a lack of proof for the facts mentioned. Leona Graham is a presenter at one of the UK's best-known radio stations, Absolute Radio, and has worked for its predecessor Virgin Radio since the early 2000s. Her best-known programme, the Absolute Classic Rock Party alone is broadcast on a prime time slot on Saturday evenings. That show has been in place there for many years --- most likely because of a huge demand, meaning a lot of listeners. If that does not make her notable, then what does? M.wernicke (talk) 08:26, 25 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Absolutely, citations are used to prove facts in the article. Everything in an article should have citations whether primary or otherwise to "prove" assertions. However, in order to have an article on a topic, notability has to be established by secondary sources. From WP:BA SIC, this may come into play here:
"If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources may not be sufficient to establish notability."
I would say that if there were a fair number of references from secondary sources (the times and guardian being examples) that this article could stay, but it needs many more than what it currently has. Therefore, I am changing my vote to Neutral with the expectation that more work will be done to find these sources.WikiManOne (talk) 01:44, 26 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, WikiManOne, for taking that into account. I would like to further contribute to this article and add more sources. But since I have so far used references only to prove facts mentioned in the article itself, I am having trouble as to how and where to add further references. There are some more mentions in the Guardian for example, but they are of a general nature: references to her voice and style, mentions of her time slots being changed, references of her staying with Virgin Radio/Absolute Radio when it was sold to its current owners etc. --- Where do you suggest I put the links to these articles when they aren't necessarily connected directly to a part of the article?
In response to your last comment I would like to add this thought: While certain people in radio might provoke wide media coverage (such as Howard Stern for example) due to their desire to get as much attention as possible, others might choose not to seek the public to such extend. It is likely that a British presenter, while well-known by his name in the UK, may not receive any media coverage at all. Leona Graham is mentioned in quite a few sources for her voice and style and her name was brought up quite frequently when Virgin Radio was sold and questions arose as to which presenters might stay with the station. She is even used as a case-study for being a national radio DJ in a book (see source, available on Google Books) read frequently by journalism students. I believe that shows notability to some extend,
Again, I would be willing to edit the article further to establish notability according to the guidelines--- and I would appreciate some help in the process.
  • If you have additional sources, like the Guardian, you should just go ahead and them right away. It's ok to redundantly source the same fact, even obvious facts, with multiple citations. Any source mentioning she is a broadcaster or voiceover artist could be used as a citation for the first sentence. You might also wish to add a "Further reading" section, if you find useful information about the topic, which doesn't work as a citation. Regardless, if you have relevant, 3rd party, reliable sources, then please definitely add them. --Rob (talk) 08:43, 26 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
M.wernicke (talk) 07:28, 26 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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