Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kyohei Ushio
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was no consensus. I don't think that further relistings would break this lack of consensus. Liz Read! Talk! 23:25, 28 December 2023 (UTC)
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- Kyohei Ushio (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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Not a notable athlete – simply competing isn't enough. Likewise does NATH provide for national championships – only international and intercontinental. InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 22:24, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sportspeople, Olympics, and Japan. InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 22:24, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
- Keep he obviously meets the 4th WP:NTRACK standard "won their country's senior national championship" after having won the national championship three times. DCsansei (talk) 00:00, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
- NTRACK states that significant coverage likely exists. Do you have any SIGCOV? InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 04:39, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
- (bit of a rant) A question: what is the point of having a criterion like that if there is absolutely no meaning to meeting it (which is essentially you're suggestion) - there should be some kind of presumption / immunity / some kind of less lenient treatment for subjects who were clearly stars in their country decades before the internet era, and in places where there is absolutely no way we can get the sources that we can be 99% sure they were covered in, absent something ludicrous like myself learning Japanese, traveling to Japan and digging through expensive offline library archives in the span of a week; now, besides that, at the Japanese wiki there are two offline sources that look like they've got a decent chance of being sigcov: one is titled "Kyohei Shio passes away - Melbourne Olympic track and field representative" from 47News (probably tossup as to whether its sigcov, but its a deadlink so we can't know as additionally the Wayback Machine never archived it on time) - then there's another one from the further reading section called "The Retsuden of Athletics" from an offline magazine. Now, I have no idea what a "retsuden" means but the fact that it is listed in the "further reading" section demonstrates that it likely is an in-depth story on him. BeanieFan11 (talk) 17:20, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
- Agreed. As I see it, the whole point of having secondary criteria is that when someone meets that criteria, there's a presumption of notability. Obviously it would be nice if we could easily access archives going back half a century but as far as this deletion discussion goes, he meets a notability criteria for retention. Hopefully the article will be worked on further. DCsansei (talk) 20:36, 24 December 2023 (UTC)
- (bit of a rant) A question: what is the point of having a criterion like that if there is absolutely no meaning to meeting it (which is essentially you're suggestion) - there should be some kind of presumption / immunity / some kind of less lenient treatment for subjects who were clearly stars in their country decades before the internet era, and in places where there is absolutely no way we can get the sources that we can be 99% sure they were covered in, absent something ludicrous like myself learning Japanese, traveling to Japan and digging through expensive offline library archives in the span of a week; now, besides that, at the Japanese wiki there are two offline sources that look like they've got a decent chance of being sigcov: one is titled "Kyohei Shio passes away - Melbourne Olympic track and field representative" from 47News (probably tossup as to whether its sigcov, but its a deadlink so we can't know as additionally the Wayback Machine never archived it on time) - then there's another one from the further reading section called "The Retsuden of Athletics" from an offline magazine. Now, I have no idea what a "retsuden" means but the fact that it is listed in the "further reading" section demonstrates that it likely is an in-depth story on him. BeanieFan11 (talk) 17:20, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
- NTRACK states that significant coverage likely exists. Do you have any SIGCOV? InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 04:39, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
- Keep: as meeting WP:NTRACK and as the Japanese wikipedia has non-trivial source(s) about him, which can then be used to grow the article more than a stub. WP:SNG like WP:NTRACK are not only tools to presume notability but also reflections of past consensus and past precedent in deletion discussions. बिनोद थारू (talk) 05:03, 28 December 2023 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.