Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jukka Kalso

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Randykitty (talk) 14:23, 29 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Jukka Kalso

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The subject fails all notability guidelines, WP:GNG, WP:SPORTSPERSON, and WP:NSPORTS, as well as violates other policies and guidelines regarding sourcing and "What Wikipedia is not". Otr500 (talk) 01:37, 22 May 2019 (UTC) Otr500 (talk) 01:37, 22 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. Otr500 (talk) 01:37, 22 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Otr500 (talk) 01:37, 22 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Finland-related deletion discussions. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 03:07, 22 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. If the International Ski Federation says that someone finished in the top three of a top-level competition twice, that is enough to establish notability. That athletic accomplishment means that the person doesn't need in-depth coverage in multiple reliable sources. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 03:07, 22 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Reply: With all due respect this is not the "International Ski Federation". The above is not according to any policies and guidelines anywhere on Wikipedia, especially concerning a BLP and significant (in depth) coverage, nor actual current community consensus. A "presumption of notability" does not guarantee automatic inclusion. There should be "objective evidence that the subject has received significant attention from independent sources to support a claim of notability". A "push" to change policies and guidelines should be on those pages so we can all be on the same page. I do see there were sources added (didn't check yet) so I removed the unsourced tag. If consensus deems the sources are acceptable regardless of being a pseudo biography there will at least be an improvement not seen since 2015. Otr500 (talk) 03:56, 22 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nom. MB190417 (talk) 09:31, 22 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Admittedly the sources found are a bit on the weak side, but that's hardly surprising for a Finnish athlete active in the 80s; most of what was written about him will not be easily accessible online – expected also for someone notable. Anyway, this is an athlete who competed in the World Cup for years and got to the podium a couple of times, with articles in eight other languages. I've tried to make this a proper stub, rather than just one short sentence and an infobox. /Julle (talk) 19:30, 22 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep meets WP:ATHLETE (although not by much). Two podiums in the World Cup, and ski-jumping is an Olympic-level sport. He didn't participate in the 1984 Sarajevo olympics, but he was 23rd in the FIS Ski Flying World Championships 1983 (the German article is better). The source added by Julle also mentions he was the personal coach of Olympic Winner Jani Soininen so that's fairly notable as well. Obviously there's not a plethora of online sources for 1980s ski-jumping. --Pudeo (talk) 13:55, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.