Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jorge Ferreira (Portuguese singer)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete all. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 19:51, 22 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Jorge Ferreira (Portuguese singer)[edit]

This article and related sub-articles are a hoax. Jorge Ferreira is presented as a huge Portuguese musician, when in fact he is a minor Pimba Portuguese American musician. I am also nominating the following related pages because they have no notability and sources, they are just an article for each and every one of Jorge Ferreira's records (including singles and compilations):

The following related images should also be deleted:

File:Jorge Ferreira WKPD.JPG

File:Jorge Ferreira - Amar Como Jesus Amou (LP album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Viva Fall River (US Version Clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Os Olhos De Minha Mãe (CD album clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Baile Dos Passarinhos (CD album clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Papai (US Version Clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Carro Preto (US Version Clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Mãe Já Partiste (US Version Clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Sonho Desfeito (US Version Clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Não Há Gente Como A Gente (CD album clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Deixei Meu Coração Em Portugal (LP album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Olhos Verdes (US Version Clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Recordar (CD album clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Regresso Prometido (US Version) - Large view.jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Nos Arraiais (CD album clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Era Pouco E Acabou-se (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Canta Natal (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Prova De Amor (US Version).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - A Portuguesa É A Mais Linda (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - 13 De Maio Na Cova De Iria (CD album) - Large view.jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Natal Em Familia (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Revelações Do Milénio (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Açoriano De Raiz (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Eu Voltarei (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - A Chupeta (US Version).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Como Este Mundo Mudou (US Version).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Vem Agosto, Vem Agosto (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - As Velhas E Os Solteirões (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Bendito Seja Agosto (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Natal Com Jorge Ferreira E Familia (CD album clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Meu Coração Bate Por Ti (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - É Bom É Bom (CD album) - Large view.jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Manel Aperta O Cinto (US Version).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Ao Vivo Vol. 1 (CD album).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - O Melhor De (CD compilation).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Super Êxitos Vol. 1 (CD compilation).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Cantor Dos Emigrantes Vol. 1 (CD compilation clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Super Êxitos Vol. 2 (US Version).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Cantor Dos Emigrantes Vol. 2 (CD compilation clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Super Êxitos Vol. 3 (CD compilation).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira & Liz Marie - ...De Colección (CD compilation).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Antologia Sucessos 1983 - 1988 (CD compilation).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Êxitos (CD compilation).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Cantor dos Emigrantes Vol. 3 (CD compilation clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Ao Vivo em Ponte da Barca (MP3 album clean).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - O Mundo Triste (45 RPM single).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Viva Fall River (EP LP).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Este Natal Santo (MP3 single).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Viva, Viva New Bedford (EP LP).jpg

File:Jorge Ferreira - Quando Vai Chegar A Paz (EP LP).jpg

These articles and images are basically the result of the work of a very limited number of editors (see Contributors):

It was created by CFernandes75 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) in his sole edit in wikipedia.
81.65.196.240 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) (account tracked to Numericable, Champs sur Marne, Paris: about 10 miles from Vitry-sur-Seine, Paris, location of Nicky Lemos Production, Jorge Ferreira's European agent see this discussion).
81.65.197.182 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) (account also tracked to Nicky Lemos Production).
81.67.242.187 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) (account also tracked to Nicky Lemos Production).
Robotixi (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) - the present big editor of this article, all the previous ones have disappeared. I suspect him to be the same person as the others (he even goes to the point of uploading a picture, one of many, where he states he is "the copyright holder of this work" at the same time saying that the author is "Claudio Fernandes; Source: Panasonic DMC-FX10 Lumix image transferred to the computer "FC"; URL: C:\Documents and Settings\Claudio\Mes documents\Mes images\Jorge Ferreira WKPD.JPG" - notice the French names in the computer... this clearly looks like user CFernandes75!).

Despite these, Nhl4hamilton and User:Hello Control (good faith established editor) also tried to do something with the article so that it could be acceptable. They failed due to the actions of the aforementioned editors whom I believe are the same person or organization. Notice that they have the same manner of editing - they hardly or never explain their actions in the talk page (and there have been some discussions about the notability and sources in the article's talk page), they never reply to questions made in their respective talk pages, and they never make any edit sumaries.

Also, and this is the main reason for this deletion proposal, Jorge Ferreira is presented as a huge Portuguese musician and even as a symbol of Portuguese culture. I, as a Portuguese have never heard of him. But of course I am not a reliable source. That is the point exactly. No reliable source is presented for the article and sub-articles in question - notice the references in the article, they are either a small interview in a local newspaper or basically spam! The editor, namely Robotixi, just ignores all the maintenance tags (and is continuously removing them) and continues to add details and statements of grandeur about this obscure musician (going to the point of adding paragraphs about him in a diversity of non-related articles such as New England). I believe that this article and sub-articles (and their number is huge, along with images uploaded) is a propaganda hoax, trying to give notability through wikipedia to a singer that has little to start with.

User Husond also believes this to be a blantant case of WP:POV, WP:COI and WP:VSCA

It should be deleted and the mentioned main editor investigated for sockpuppetry. Thank you. The Ogre (talk) 13:44, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. -- — LinguistAtLarge • Talk 14:49, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Portugal-related deletion discussions. -- — LinguistAtLarge • Talk 14:49, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Living people-related deletion discussions. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 00:01, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Note: All the mentioned users have been invited to participate in this debate. The Ogre (talk) 14:57, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion[edit]

Delete Unless better sources than the subject's hometown newspaper or his web site can be found to verify all the gold records he is claimed to have here and in Portugal. The local paper article sounds like it is quoting his press release. On the talk page of the article, editors have stated they have not been able to find his "hits" in the relevant Portuguese music charts. His "big hit" Viva Fall River (EP) is claimed to have sold 10,000 copies and to be a "gold record," but in the US it takes at least 500,000 copies sold to get that recognition per RIAA. Better referencing than the singer's web site is necessary. Edison (talk) 18:12, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - Maybe relevant, maybe not: The article has apparently be deleted from ptwiki [1]. — LinguistAtLarge • Talk 18:09, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment I could not find a link to the deletion debate on the Portuguese Wiki. Is there one? Apparently the editors there were 9 to 0 in favor of deletion. Edison (talk) 18:18, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  - Here's the page, but there's not a lot of discussion there. [2] — LinguistAtLarge • Talk 18:40, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    - Wow, those guys on Portuguese Wiki just plain "vote" with no reason given. What a concept! Edison (talk) 17:09, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      - In fact that is a completely different Jorge Ferreira (member of a Portuguese band called The Other Side). The lack of reasons has to due with the fact that the main article (about the band) had been deleted because of non-notability (subsequentely all the separate articles for the individual band members were also deleted). The Ogre (talk) 10:33, 18 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        As far as I can tell there is no article, and there has never been one, about the Jorge Ferreira in question in the Portuguese wikipedia. That goes a long way to disprove any claims of notability... The Ogre (talk) 10:38, 18 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as utter vanispamcruftisement. Hús ö nd 18:38, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Ola bom dia Ogre. Eu apresento-me : o meu nome é Claudio Fernandes, sou o usuario chamado Robotixi (CFernandes75). Sou filho de emigrantes madeirenses em Paris e tenho 27 anos. Em primeiro, eu queria pedir desculpa a todos aqueles a quem eu não falei sobre o meu artigo, incluindo você. Sou um grande fan do cantor Jorge Ferreira, que eu escuto desde os meus 5 anos de idade. É verdade que este cantor tem mais sucesso no estrangeiro, principalmente nos Estados Unidos, do que em Portugal mesmo, porque éle é um cantor da emigração portuguesa. De facto, em vista dos anos desde que eu o escuto, este cantor tem um valor muito importante para mim, sentimental, afectual, familiar e nostalgico. Quem sabe apreciar a musica, a voz, o talento deste artista em todas as suas canções descobre um grande senhor da musica popular portuguesa, com mais de 30 anos de carreira, um grande cantor português exceptional, que normalmente hoje em dia devia ter ainda mais sucesso e ainda mais fama do que actualmente, pois este cantor não é reconhecido ao seu real valor. Eu sempre defendi o Jorge Ferreira em toda parte, eu sempre defendi a minha pagina neste Wikipedia, e sempre continuarei de o fazer. A explicação das minhas cancelações dos seus manutenciamentos é muito simples : Cada vez que eu escrevo um detalhe no meu artigo, para mim eu penso que a notabilidade esta posta. Ou cada vez que eu ponho uma referência, eu penso que o artigo ja esta mais credivél. Eu não conheço muito o funcionamento de Wikipedia e queria vos pedir perdão e também ajuda. É por isso que eu pesso a você para não cancelar a pagina Jorge Ferreira (Portuguese singer), por favor. Eu estou pronto a contacta-o para falar com você fora do Wikipedia, no seu E-mail personal, se você quer, e também posso o dar o meu e-mail personal. Assim, a gente fala-se os dois, a dizer-me por favor qual são exactamente as partes do meu artigo que não passa a vista, que falta referência ou que esta mal escrito, o que falta, etc... Eu farei o maximo para reescrever o meu artigo com a vossa ajuda, e também tomarei eu a ocasião para aprender com você o sistema do Wikipedia. Mais por favor, seja indulgente, não cancela o meu artigo !! Eu espero ansiosamente uma resposta sua. Muito obrigado. Robofr 18:54, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
- Here is a machine translation of Robotixi's comment — LinguistAtLarge • Talk 19:28, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  Hello and good day Ogre. Let me introduce myself: my name is Claudio Fernandes, and I'm the user called Robotixi (CFernandes75). I am the son of Madeiran immigrants in Paris and I have 27 years. First, I wanted to apologize to all of those to whom I did not talk about my article, including you. I am a big fan of singer Jorge Ferreira, which I listen since I was 5 years of age. It is true that this singer has more success abroad, especially in the United States, than in Portugal itsef, because he is a singer of Portuguese emigration. Indeed, in view of the years I have been listening to this singer, he has a very important value for me, sentimental, of feelings, family-connected and nostalgic. Those of are able to enjoy the music, the voice, the talent of this artist in all his songs find a great master of Portuguese popular music, with over 30 years of career, a great singer Portuguese exceptional, which normally today should have more success and fame more than now, because this singer is not recognized for its real value. I have always defended Jorge Ferreira everywhere, I have always defended my page in Wikipedia, and will always continue to do so. The explanation for my removel of your maintenance tags is very simple: Each time I write a detail in my article, I think that notability is proven. Or every time I put a reference, I think the article is more credible. I do not know much about Wikipedia functioning, and I wanted to ask for your forgiveness and help. That is why I ask you personally not to delete the page Jorge Ferreira (Portuguese singer), please. I am ready to contact you and talk to you outside of Wikipedia, in your personal e-mail, and, if you want, I can also give you my personal e-mail. Thus, we two can talk, so you can tell me please which exactly are the parts of my article that do not pass inspection, lack references or is poorly written, what's missing, etc ... I will do my best to rewrite my article with your help, and I also take this opportunity to learn from you the system of Wikipedia. Even more, please, be indulgent, do not cancel my article! I eagerly await your answer. Thank you very much.
  - Note: Corrected the machine translation. My bold. The Ogre (talk) 12:54, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
- Robofr, this is the English Wikipedia, please use English in your comments. The fact that you admire this singer so much is unfortunately not enough for him to have an article on Wikipedia. We have criteria for notability that one must meet before having an article on themselves. Please read the criteria for inclusion. Hmm, do I recognize your signature from somewhere? Hús ö nd 20:33, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete--phew, that will be one fell swoop if the AfD ends with 'delete.' I see no evidence whatsoever of this person's notability, or of that of the many records. With appreciation for nominator's blood, sweat, and tears. Drmies (talk) 21:20, 15 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - I actually have "A Portuguesa É A Mais Linda" in my playlist, but this is some serious cruft here. If - if - a neutral biography of Ferreira can be written, then I have no prejudice against recreation, but what we have now is just excessive. - Biruitorul ^Talk 01:15, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete all collected articles. This singer is largely unknown in Portugal, and certainly not notable enough to warrant an article. Same goes for the articles about his songs. Flamarande (talk) 21:57, 19 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as not notable/hoax. To the closing admin, you have your work cut out for you. :) TheAE talk/sign 19:37, 22 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.