Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jay Greenberg

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Snow Keep. Mark Arsten (talk) 01:53, 6 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Jay Greenberg

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Non-notable, although there was some media attention when he was younger I believe he does not meet notability requirements per http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:COMPOSER#Criteria_for_composers_and_lyricists Opaqueambiguity (talk) 05:23, 30 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Strong Keep -- He really is quite famous, as one can see here, here, and here. Jay Greenberg in quotation marks gives me more than 75,000 hits on Google. Tillander 05:53, 30 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I guess my argument hinges on the fact that his fame seems to be from the fact that he was a talented youngster, and not that he is notable for being a composer. Sure he's been published and has records for sell on amazon, but there are probably hundreds if not thousands of people with records out and published scores who aren't on wikipedia.

Has credit for writing or co-writing either lyrics or music for a notable composition. - Not that I'm aware of

Has written musical theatre of some sort (includes musicals, operas, etc.) that was performed in a notable theatre that had a reasonable run as such things are judged in their particular situation and time. - I don't think so, a ballet commissioned by the NYC Ballet is listed but is unsourced and not mentioned anywhere else in the article. Google search didn't give me too much on this piece, although it did confirm the commission. However, other than the fact that it was commissioned I didn't find anything concerning the length of it's run or any other details. If this could be fleshed out some more and shown to fulfill this one I would retract my argument.

Has had a work used as the basis for a later composition by a songwriter, composer or lyricist who meets the above criteria. - Not that I'm aware of

Has written a composition which has won (or in some cases been given a second or other place) in a major music competition not established expressly for newcomers. - Not that I'm aware of

Has been listed as a major influence or teacher of a composer, songwriter or lyricist that meets the above criteria. Appears at reasonable length in standard reference books on his or her genre of music. - Definitely no.

Opaqueambiguity (talk) 10:10, 30 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - Definitely notable, as per Tillander. AuthorAuthor (talk) 08:22, 30 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. A search on HighBeam brings up several articles, such as "Composer Jay Greenberg Profile" (60 minutes - 2006), "LIBRARY OF CONGRESS TO RECEIVE ORIGINAL MANUSCRIPT OF COMPOSITION BY TEEN PRODIGY JAY GREENBERG" (US Federal News Service - 2007), "Josua Bell, violin" (Strings - 2008, states "Sony Records recently released his [Greenberg's] debut CD: Symphony No. 5, written at age 12 and recorded by the London Symphony Orchestra, and his Quintet for Strings, featuring the Juilliard Quartet and cellist Darrett Adkins."), "Kid Composer Just Lets It Flow" (AP Online - 2006), "Boy wonder" (Town & Country - 2007), "TEEN'S CONCERTO PREMIERED AT CARNEGIE HALL" (Cincinatti Post - 2007), "Backstory: The child prodigy in few of us; A symphony by a 14-year-old composer gets this writer all riled up. But what can one do but applaud?" (Christian Science Monitor - 2006). Pretty clearly notable, I'd say. --Michig (talk) 12:13, 30 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Clearly passes General Notability Guideline and notability is not temporary. The various sub-criteria such as Wikipedia:COMPOSER, are alternative criteria. They are not required if the subject already passes the General Notability Guideline. In addition to the many other articles listed above (note that the review of the premiere of his violin concerto was carried on Associated Press and appeared worldwide), there was an article about him in BBC Music Magazine [1] and a significant segment on this BBC Radio 3 program was devoted to him. His works have been recorded by a major record label and performed by notable artists. Voceditenore (talk) 14:15, 30 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Found another article on him in the NY Times. There is still another article just on him at Financial Times (paywall). Coverage twice in the NY Times, in USA Today, in FT (granted not a music-related paper, but clearly a reliable source) and mention (though not in-depth) in New Yorker enough for notability. Churn and change (talk) 18:15, 30 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Weak Keep There's definitely enough strong sourcing on Greenberg to keep the article. I say 'weak' only because the sourcing tends to be all about him being a young prodigy - not much in the last few years, so I do have a few doubts about notability that lasts. Nonetheless, enough sourcing from the original articles to keep. Nwlaw63 (talk) 22:55, 30 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. — Frankie (talk) 19:20, 1 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.