Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bloodsongs

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. No-one has argued for deletion since additional sources were presented. There cannot be a consensus to delete in those circumstances. Mkativerata (talk) 05:37, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

Bloodsongs

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Science fiction-related deletion discussions. Punkrocker1991 (talk) 11:46, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

Bloodsongs (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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No evidence of notability given Pesky (talk …stalk!) 11:59, 5 October 2011 (UTC)

• Delete: Fails Wikipedia:Notability (books) (which, by analogy, also applies to magazines) + WP:CONFLICT (the creator of the article was an editor of the magazine). HairyWombat 15:22, 5 October 2011 (UTC)

• Delete fails WP:GNG. Stuartyeates (talk) 06:36, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

• Keep I agree that this stub needs a lot of work, but with a rewrite and some additional links feel that this mag could pass the test (among its claims to fame is that it had an issue banned in Queensland. I'll see what I can do, but would welcome the input of others as I won't have time to do a thorough edit of this entry for a couple of weeks. Punkrocker1991 (talk) 07:54, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

  Comment: It really needs to be the other way around; find the references first, then keep. Note that if the stub is deleted then it can always be recreated. I have looked, and found no sources for this magazine. Being banned in Queensland looks more hopeful as it should have produced some news stories. However, for notability, it would be better if these were national sources, not local. HairyWombat 18:54, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

Apparently not; I found a page by one of the magazine's creators which mentions the media's lack of interest in the ban. Looks like a Delete to me at present. MorganaFiolett (talk) 14:37, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

• Reference added from the Melbourne University Press Encyclopaedia of Science Fiction & Fantasy (1998), edited by Paul Collins. page 143, Steve Proposch: "...launched Australia's first professional horror and dark fantasy magazine, Bloodsongs, with Chris Masters in 1994. The first three issues were edited and published in collaboration, but the next five issues were edited and published by Proposch alone. This is evident in the swing away from graphic horror to a more balanced approach." This suggests to me as evidence of notability ("Australia's first professional horror mag") as well as a reliable source commenting on its trends. Bloodsongs is also discussed in the entry for Dark Fantasy, on page 47 of the MUP Encyclopaedia. Does this help? Punkrocker1991 (talk) 11:46, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

• Another reference from Bonescribes: Year's Best Australian Horror 1995, p.135, "A History of Australian Horror" by Bill Congreve, Sean McMullen and Steve Paulsen (I believe that this article was nominated for or won the Milliam Atheling Jr award). "issue 1 received some criticism for tending towards the splatter end of the genre... A Category One Restricted rating by the Attorney General's department saw it restricted to readers 18 years and older, and banned altogether in the state of Queensland." The total description for Bloodsongs runs to almost half a page in a 16 page article that covers approximately 130 years of publishing. I believe this comes closer to carrying this entry over the line under multiple independent references. Punkrocker1991 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 12:12, 12 October 2011 (UTC).

• Correction to the above, the William Atheling Jr award was won by the article "The Hunt for Australian Horror" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ditmar_award_results#1996:_Swancon_21.2C_Perth, of which the above reference is a revised edition. Punkrocker1991 (talk) 12:22, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

• Keep Note I am the original author of this stub. Bloodsongs magazine published a number of young authors and artists for the first time, or in early stages of their careers, if that is of any help. Recent Oscar winner Shaun Tan illustrated a story in Bloodsongs, and authors published included Sean Williams, Rick Kennett, Lucy Sussex, Leanne Frahm, Bryce J. Stevens, and Kirstyn McDermott. Regular contributors included Rob Hood, Bill Congreve and Steven Paulsen. Dubbothedevo (talk) 13:14, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

• Bloodsongs published an impressive list of writers, but sadly someone will say that notability isn't inherited: i.e. Bloodsongs doesn't become notable just because it published folks who are notable. It's just one of the rules. Do you have any old references kicking around in dead tree form - were there ever any reviews in Van Ikin's Science Fiction, or Aurealis, or Eidolon? I've found a few other minor references, like in the intro to The Year's Best Science Fiction and Fantasy Vol 1 (edited by Strahan and Byrne) but they are minor. Did any stories from Bloodsongs win any awards? That might help. I know that two were reprinted in Bonescribes, did Datlow/Windling reprint any? Punkrocker1991 (talk) 13:45, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.