Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ben Higham-Smith

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. MBisanz ^talk 13:30, 12 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Ben Higham-Smith

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WOMAA is not the karaté world championship or kickboxing world championships so he cannot be titled world champion; His musical career is not notable. So fails WP:NSPORTS, WP:MUSBIO and WP:BIO and WP:GNG Domdeparis (talk) 11:20, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

There are more than one governing body for Karate and Kickboxing. WOMAA (which stands for the World Organization of Martial Arts Athletes) is a governing body for numerous Martial Arts. On their website, stay that "All competitors who compete in the WOMAA World Martial Games are of Olympic Caliber and travel each year to the games to find out who will win the Gold and earn the right to become a WOMAA World Champion". So, he could and was be titled World Champion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jamesdavis1992 (talk • contribs) 11:44, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

WTKA is also a very well known governing body for various Martial Arts. He left this World Championships with a Bronze medal, therefore he competed at "World Championship or Olympic quality", as stated in the Wikipedia guidelines for an article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jamesdavis1992 (talk • contribs) 11:53, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Humm couldn't find much about either governing body and they don't have their own wikipedia pages...you know it's very easy to create an association and write that all the competitors are of Olympic standard...it doesn't make it true...especially as neither karate or kickboxing are Olympic sports. Please read Kickboxing and Karate for more information. This is the explanation from the web site of what the competition is...

a TRUE international competition which is OPEN to All Styles, All Systems, All Belt Ranks (Beginners, Intermediates, Advanced and all Black Belts), and all ages (kids and adults) doesn't sound like what you could call a world championship to me...I think we can safely say that the subject is not what you could call a world champion...Domdeparis (talk) 14:11, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

WTKA is the Traditional Karate section of the WKA. WKA overlook WTKA. WKA has a Wikipedia page. All it takes is a simple search to find that out. It's okay though, I found it for you (http://www.wkaassociation.com/category/world-events/) . If you were to ask any Karate athlete, in any part of the world, if they'd heard of WTKA/WKA, then you'd get a unanimous yes. Also, Karate is an Olympic Sport. If you didn't know that, I don't think you're the right person to comment on the validity of any governing body. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jamesdavis1992 (talk • contribs) 16:59, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

So we agree that we can forget the "world champion" bit? In June this year it was decided that Karate will be an Olympic sport for the first time in 2020 but this is the first time and in the article you need to provide a source that proves that he was that he was bronze medalist in the WTKA world championships in 2010, I have looked and can't find it unfortunately. We are talking about a junior medal I suppose at the age of 15/16? IMHO a bronze medal as a junior fails WP:NSPORTS Domdeparis (talk) 18:22, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Not a all. I think we need somebody'/ else's input on this, apart from you and I. Nope; the category he got Bronze in was ages 16-39. I think we need somebody else's opinion on what classifies as a sporting achievement at World Championship level. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jamesdavis1992 (talk • contribs) 18:43, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

That's what this page is for but you must add sources to claims if you want them to be accepted. Domdeparis (talk) 19:25, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I will be adding sources to that part of the article, over the next 24 hours. I've asked to meet with Ben to ask him more about it tomorrow, as I train with him. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jamesdavis1992 (talk • contribs) 21:28, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Martial arts-related deletion discussions. Peter Rehse (talk) 23:11, 29 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Comment I have fixed up some of the formatting (especially the references). The lack of references through out the article makes notability a big question but I am willing to wait for the original author to beef those up before I comment further on the claims themselves.Peter Rehse (talk) 14:51, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: A single Bronze? It doesn't sound very much like notability to a non-expert. A search gives practically no sign of notability (although Google guesses 35 hits, there are actually fewer than 20, nothing substantial among them). Chiswick Chap (talk) 16:30, 4 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I do not see the significant independent coverage required to meet WP:GNG. WOMAA has over 500 divisions from 6 and under beginners to 54 and over black belts and crowns a "world champion" in all of those categories. As a 16 year old who had studied martial arts for 1 year I doubt he was competing "at the highest level". There's nothing to indicate he's notable in either the martial arts or music business. There also appears to be a strong COI since the article was created by someone who trains with him. Papaursa (talk) 03:55, 5 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.