Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Anti-revisionism

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep‎. This decision is influenced in part by the nominator informally withdrawing his desire to see this article deleted. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:36, 11 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Anti-revisionism[edit]

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This article is a mess of OR and has been for some time. It consists almost entirely of a long polemical essay, with a list of political parties, all without a single citation or even a pretension to cite reliable sources. The external links are entirely to non-independent sources on Marxist websites. I tried searching for reliable sources on this subject, but couldn't find anything that wasn't from a Marxist website or magazine.

The previous AfD discussion resulted in a keep, conditional on the article being cleaned up. But 15 years have since passed and no clean up has occurred. As such I'm proposing that this article be deleted or redirected to a better-constructed article (maybe Revisionism (Marxism)?). Maybe someone can rebuild it better at a later date, but at minimum, I think this current iteration needs to be blown up and started over. Grnrchst (talk) 19:32, 4 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Politics and Social science. Grnrchst (talk) 19:32, 4 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Delete definitely a TNT case for me: it's an unsourced, OR mess even if significant coverage in RS were found. (t · c) buidhe 05:34, 5 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - this is clearly a notable phenomenon, and is by no means impossible to construe a good quality article with references. I pruned it to remove the whole essay. --Soman (talk) 11:58, 6 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Soman: Do you know of there being significant courage in independent reliable sources? Just asking because I couldn't find anything that wasn't from a Marxist publication. -- Grnrchst (talk) 11:34, 7 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, there is certainly material for expansion and referencing. And 'Marxist publication' is a very broad concept. As Anti-Revisionism isn't monopoly of a single organization, so 'independent' isn't really an issue. I'd have no problem using a Chinese equivalent of Great Soviet Encyclopedia to extract a definition of Anti-Revisionism, as long as the source is clearly attributed. --Soman (talk) 13:37, 7 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Europe and China in the Cold War: Exchanges Beyond the Bloc Logic and the Sino-Soviet Split (pp. 93-97) has a chapter on emergence of anti-revisionism in Chinese interactions with Western Europe, but stops short of providing an encyclopedia definition of anti-revisionism. --Soman (talk) 14:08, 7 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. It's a poor quality article that needs much work - not least to broaden the subject to cover Irish Republican anti-revisionism [1] and Israeli anti-revisionism [2] as well as "traditional" post-Khrushchev anti-revisionism, e.g. [China Review https://www.jstor.org/stable/26838897]. There are plenty of WP:RS sources here, academic and otherwise. Fiachra10003 (talk) 22:27, 9 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Keep It is an obscure political communist movement that was in vogue in the 1950's. Unfortunately the article is a mess and needs a proper rewrite. It been needing done for more than a decade but worth keeping until it can be researched and expanded. scope_creep^Talk 11:43, 11 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: Soman's edits have served to drastically improve the article from a long OR mess to a rather short but informative stub, backed by reliable sources. I'm still unconvinced that it's distinctly notable from the subject of revisionism, but that's a topic for a merge discussion, rather than an AfD. Anyways, my concerns when I raised this AfD have been addressed, so I'm no longer opposed to this article being kept. Nice work Soman. --Grnrchst (talk) 12:06, 11 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
- Many thanks Grnrchst. I think the anti-revisionist communist movement (encompassing CPC, PLA, their sympathizers and some others) is a distinct phenomenon, that is difficult to fit into the Revisionism (Marxism) article. Now two issues - on one hand 'revisionism' is a pejorative globally in the communist movement. No communist would admit to being a revisionist, and there have been several 'anti-revisionist campaigns' (like in early Soviet Union) that aren't exactly part of the post-Stalin anti-revisionism. I suggest drawing a hard line at 1953, including no stuff earlier than that. On the other hand, there are several other movements dubbed 'anti-revisionist' (Jewish, Irish, Balkans, etc..), which cannot be fitted in here. So at some point it might make sence to move the article to Anti-Revisionism (Marxism-Leninism) or Anti-Revisionism in the International Communist Movement after 1956 or something like that. --Soman (talk) 13:44, 11 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.