User talk:Milkbreath/archive1

Welcome to Wikipedia!!!

Hello Milkbreath/archive1! Welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. If you decide that you need help, check out Wikipedia:Where to ask a question, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. Below are some recommended guidelines to facilitate your involvement. Happy Editing! User:Harlowraman Getting Started Wikipedia Tutorial How to edit a page The five pillars of Wikipedia Manual of Style Be bold in editing How to write a great article WikiProjects Getting your info out there Neutral Point of View Attribution Cite your sources Uploading images Image use policy Getting more Wikipedia rules Policy Library Getting Help New contributors' help page Where to ask a question Help Desk Frequently Asked Questions Getting along Wikiquette Civility Sign your posts Wikipedians Conflict resolution Getting technical Pages needing attention Peer review Utilities Village pump Harlowraman 18:27, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

Resume rewriting

Hi! Nice to see a new face ready to take action and fix things! If you do get around to rewriting Tatjana Aparac-Jelušić's page, care to take a look at Jadranka Lasić-Lazić's next? I can't find anything in there, and there was no comment in response to the notability tag for that one, but perhaps you can see something I'm missing? -Bbik^★ 17:11, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Right back atcha. I'm still thinking about that resume rewrite. I just went and looked at that other page you name, and now I'm starting to think that, other than a brief bio, a scholar's page is going to look like a resume anyhow.

As to the notability question, there are a couple of ways of looking at it, as I see it. 1. Wikipedia is supposed to be an encyclopedia, and we should be trying to make it one, so we shouldn't include every college professor on earth willy-nilly. 2. Define "encyclopedia." Good. Now define "Wikipedia." All right, now--are they the same? Not really. Until the Wiki Gods strike down the minor cricketers and the video game characters, I'm not going to mess with a poor, hard-working librarian.

To be honest, I lean toward option one, but I'm new here, so I'm only going to "be bold" in spurts. Milkbreath 04:03, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Heh, I like the reasoning with view 2. Amusing as it is, though, that logic wouldn't hold much sway over view 1, which is the actual policy. However, here are a couple example pages (scientists rather than librarians, and with FAR more information, but still scholars) to give you an idea of how they can be improved from the basic resume.

And a few pointers to help you with formatting -- colons (:) can be used to indent; they also force a line break, unlike a regular carriage return. The number sign (#) does the same thing with numbers,

1. like
2. so,

and they automatically count, too. (Handy in longer lists!) Headers you've probably seen in the articles themselves (== == for the highest level, === === for the next, and so on), two apostrophes for italics ('' ''), three for bold (''' '''), five for both. Beyond that, if you have any questions, feel free to ask! Wouldn't want to bore you too much explaining things you already know. :)

Don't worry about being too bold, though. People here are generally friendly, so if you do mess up, someone'll let you know, and then you'll know for next time. But as long as you have a brain, you should be fine anyhow; my biggest problem was with how to code things, and I'm still learning that as I go. -Bbik^★ 16:44, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the tips. There's little danger at this point of telling me something I already know about Planet Wiki. I came here to edit text, and that's what I intend to do, but I'm starting to see that I'll probably not be able to avoid learning a few things, too. I used to program in C++, so how hard can markup be?

You speak of policy, but the overriding policy mentioned in the, what is it, five pillars is "ignore all rules." I take that to mean something like "use your own judgement if you're one of those people who can think straight," and I think I am. Notability is not the only criterion to be applied, nor are the "rules." If I can imagine a person finding Tatjana or Jadranka and being glad they did, then their articles belong here. Too, Wikipedia is supposed to be an encyclopedia cum almanac, and the ideal almanac would contain every fact there is. My hope is that server space will grow and grow until that goal is accomplished.

Are we "chatting?" Is this the right place for this conversation? Milkbreath 17:12, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

If you have a programming background, you should be all set. I certainly don't, but haven't had too many problems -- I'm even starting to poke at template code now! And yeah, that's pretty much the idea for policy, use it when it works, bend it when it doesn't, but make sure it's not beyond reason.

Chatting? Naw, we're... discussing editting guidelines! But really, as long as you stay away from "Hi!" "Hi! How are you?" "I'm good, you? Nice weather today?" nobody's going to make a fuss. Discussing how policy/rules/etc are interpretted contributes to people working together constructively, discussing specific topics contributes to each person's understanding of the topic, which helps them to write the relevant articles better... Again, it's all a case of staying within reason. -Bbik^★ 17:57, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Oghuz Turks

{{helpme}} Please look at the recent change to the article Oghuz Turks, and tell me two things: Is it vandalism, and what should I routinely do about vandalism when I find it? I hesitate to undo.

Normally, I'd say removing large chunks of text without any explanation is vandalism, but in this case, I'd actually leave it out, regardless of the intent -- the whole thing is uncited, keeps refering back to "the author" (Who? The one who wrote it, which makes that section original research? Or a valid, completely uncited source?), and has been tagged as needing a citation for a while anyhow (A month or two actually isn't bad, but it has enough other issues anyhow.). It's also more a history of Turkey and/or Turks in general than these specific ones, and if it were more specific, it would just be a duplicate of the "Origins" section.

As for what to do when you find vandalism, the undo option is a wonderful feature, feel free to use it. If there are multiple edits to be reverted, go the the page history, click on the last good version of the article, then edit/save that page. Clicking edit on an old version will give you a complaint at the top, but if it's because you're reverting vandalism, just ignore it and resave that version. Be careful someone didn't sneak in a good edit amidst the bad, though, that way you can readd that good edit when you edit the old version. -Bbik^★ 23:34, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Hey, it's my Fairy Godsister! Thanks for the prompt reply, and thanks for the formatting. The whole article indeed wobbles, but the change was made by an ISP. That set a flag for me (that's programmer talk). I will do nothing. Milkbreath 23:43, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Copyedit

Hello my fellow WikiProject colleague! I saw you have nicely improved English language in several my articles. Can you please look at recently expanded Těrlicko article and check the language, please? I am not native English speaker :). Thank you. - Darwinek 16:51, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Dobry den. I don't know Polish, and that's about all the Czech I know, but I've heard that you guys say something similar. I don't even know which diacritic belongs on the "y", so I didn't use one. I've been moving through the lists at the Czech project page copyediting. I'd be happy to look at any article you want. I'll go and do Těrlicko (thank heaven for cut-and-paste) now.

Let me ask you—am I supposed to respond here or on your talk page? I'm kind of new to this. Milkbreath 17:14, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your kind response. Only possible diacritic for y is "ý", it appears in Czech and Slovak languages. Yeah, Polish language is similar but paradox is, that Czechs and Poles speak to themselves most often English because they do not understand each other :). Other situation is in area where I live (Těrlicko lies here, too) where most of people understand both Czech and Polish. You can respond wherever you want, maybe my talk page will be better, because I will always see that yellow bar on the top, when new message will arrive. - Darwinek 17:24, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for nice copyedit. I am glad you feel nice here :). I answered your six questions on article's talk page. I guess you are from the USA, which state? I am kind of interested in American issues and I like geography a lot. :) - Darwinek 19:31, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

You're quite welcome, but we're not done. See Talk:Těrlicko. I live in New Jersey, about seven miles from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. It's pretty flat here. Sandy soil. It used to be woods, farms and orchards, but now it's all houses. The good news is that the trees have grown back between the houses, and the area looks like a forest from a certain angle. --Milkbreath 19:55, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

I live in quite mountainous area, it is very beautiful, see e.g. [1]. I am sure you would love it here. - Darwinek 20:19, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. It is really much better now :). I will let you know in the future when another copyediting help will be needed. Thank you and take care. :) - Darwinek 21:47, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Just sticking in a little comment -- You can respond wherever you choose, whether always on your talk page (keeps everything in one place), always on the other person's page (they'll definitely see there's a response because of the new messages box), or back and forth depending on the person, though it's typically a good idea to keep it consistant within each conversation. If you plan to always respond here, it's probably a good idea to make a note at the top so people will know to either periodically check or watchlist your page. Or, as I've seen several people do, you could respond here, and leave a quick note on their page to let them know (though that seems like unneeded extra work to me). There have been a couple people I've talked with who will cut the question and paste it with an answer on the asker's page each time, too, which certainly keeps all the pieces together, but also seems like it involves extra work. I find it's easiest to just go with whatever the other person does, and if their preference isn't clear, it's up to you. -Bbik^★ 00:00, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Candide

Hey. I just wanted to say "thanks" for the copyedit. I appreciate it. -- Rmrfstar 00:52, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

I do intend to work further on the article. -- Rmrfstar 03:03, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Copyedit

Hello. Can you please look at Henryk Jasiczek article and do some copyedit, especially that epitaph under the photo. I tried to translate it, I hope you will get the message, that a poet tried to express. Thank you ;). - Darwinek 15:44, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

I added the graduation year from a journalism school and changed reclusion to seclusion. As for Oldrzychowice, I yesterday recorded an audio with correct Czech and Polish spelling of the name of that village. You can find it in the lead of the article, if you are interested how does it sound :). Thank you very much. I feel kind of embarrassed asking you for help over and over again. :) - Darwinek 17:34, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Peer review/Banner of Poland/archive1

Hi, Milkbreath. Sorry for not having replied earlier. Please see my reply on the peer review page. — Kpalion^(talk) 18:18, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

re your edits at Mycenaean Greece

BC/AD is a convention always used in Wikipedia articles on specifically Christian subjects. In non-Christian subjects, however, changing established BCE/CE usage to BC/AD is a discourtesy, rather like "correcting" spelling to American practice. I'm sure you understand that whatever convention is established in an article, we simply go with it. Will you clean up your changes at your next edit at Mycenaean Greece. Thank you. --Wetman 22:02, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

I see, now that Ive checked ancient page history, that this article began with BC 10:41, 8 April 2004. So it's stuck in that mode. My error: you so rarely see "BC" in professional literature. --Wetman 22:13, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Welcome to WikiProject Czech Republic!

Hi, and welcome to the Czech Republic WikiProject!

• We are the project collecting, improving and maintaining articles related to the Czech Republic, Czechoslovakia, medieval Bohemia, Moravia and Silesia and Samo's Empire
• Please feel free to add membership userbox on your page {{User WikiProject Czech Republic}}
• If you spot any article within the scope of our project please add our tag {{WikiProject Czech Republic}} on its talk page
• In case of any questions use talk page of our project
• We wish you happy editing !
• ≈Tulkolahten≈^≈talk≈ 20:09, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

AIV and "recent" blocks

Thank you for making a report at Wikipedia:Administrator intervention against vandalism. Reporting and removing vandalism is vital to the functioning of Wikipedia and all users are encouraged to revert, warn, and report vandalism. However, administrators generally only block users if they have received a recent final warning (one that mentions that the user may be blocked) and they have recently vandalized after that warning was given. The reported user has not yet been blocked because it appears this has not occurred yet. If this user continues to vandalize after their final warning, please report them to the AIV noticeboard again. Thank you. —C.Fred (talk) 21:47, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Had the vandal in question been a registered user, then yes, final warning would have occurred, and I may have blocked. (I might have issued an additional final warning, since the user did not vandalize recently after the final warning.)

However, because the vandal is editing from an IP address, we cannot assume that it is the same person who edited in May. Accordingly, a fresh set of warnings is usually in order. That said, if there is a clear pattern of vandalism--they always add text X to article Y, even though they only show up once a month--then they can be blocked with much more haste.

Finally, the nature of the vandalism is important. Adding "hi" is minor but still vandalism. Vandalism of a more severe, obscene, or libelous nature will lead to a block much more quickly.

All things considered, I can't fault you for what you did. With good faith, you reported a vandal that you saw had been warned on their talk page. Blocking policy is not always simple; I have to go back and consult the guidelines every so often myself. —C.Fred (talk) 22:07, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

If you haven't found it already, WP:TUSER is the list of templates for user talk pages, i.e. warning templates. Don't forget to substitute them by typing something along the lines of {{subst:welcome}}. —C.Fred (talk) 00:43, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Manzanar Copyedit

Thanks for your copyedits and comments on Manzanar. I've gone over your edits/suggestions and have made some edits taking your suggestions into consideration. Please check it out when you get a chance. Thanks again! I appreciate the help! Gmatsuda 18:31, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

BTW: Feel free to add your support the FA nomination for Manzanar! :-) Gmatsuda 07:35, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Greetings once again. The Manzanar FAC could really use your help...more than the copyedit!. It was nominated about a month ago, but things are going slowly. As of now, it looks like it's going to fail due to lack of interest, which is really quite sad. Hope you can help by adding your support (if you feel it merits your support, of course)! -- Gmatsuda 07:42, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

		The Copyeditor's Barnstar
		Thank you so much for your excellent CE work on Manzanar. Your efforts helped it reach FA status. Deeply appreciate your contributions! -- Gmatsuda 22:10, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Bratislava copyedit

Hello. Thanks for your lead copy-editing – of course, that is excluded from no-edit advice as long as meaning doesn't change. However, I'm trying to find someone disinterested to do a thorough copyedit and remove redundancy or repetition as necessary, but looks like Murphy's laws are winning so far – when I need help I just don't get it. Although we don't have criticism for bad writing, an improvement would be still appreciated. MarkBA ^t/c/@ 19:08, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Good. I see you're already going down through the sections, and I have some comments: to try and remove repetition between History and Demographics sections and of course, to keep original spelling, which is British English in this case. MarkBA ^t/c/@ 08:20, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Nope, I haven't noticed anything like that so far, it's just some kind of "precaution" as it happened that spellings mixed up. But I'll wait and see how the copy-edit will get done. MarkBA ^t/c/@ 10:19, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Now the copy-editing is done I think odds are bit better. To the Government, I've only reworded "Mayor" sentence to clarify. If you don't see any major issues with this article, comment it at the FAC candidature (of course I expect support). MarkBA ^t/c/@ 16:36, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your excellent copyediting work! Tankred 15:43, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Hello. I've noticed that you've commented on nationalities, but that's not my topic now, because if you'd like, you could comment on the FAC page History section and if you agree that the 20th century is too long, suggest what should be (re)moved. Regards, MarkBA ^t/c/@ 13:04, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks

Thank you for nice words :). I will be glad to ask you for another copyediting in the future, when I will create or expand some articles. However I have now a little time to do large edits as the school duties are coming again. I will let you know when I will need your help, btw your merit in Těrlicko article is substantial and this article looks nice also thanks to you. Feel free to let me know when you will need some help also. - Darwinek 19:10, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

Big Timber Creek

I noticed your work on Big Timber Creek, looks good so far. Not sure if you have seen Paulins Kill, but it is another tributary of the Delaware River in New Jersey and a Featured Article. Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 00:02, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

• There are two other featured stream articles, both in Pennsylvania (and I am the principal author for both of them): Larrys Creek and White Deer Hole Creek. Do you know about USGS GNIS? - here is the link for the creek and its North and South branches. The WikiProject Rivers page is another good place to look for ideas. Keep up the good work, Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 00:40, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

Hello again

Hello. I have less time to do major Wikipedia edits, nevertheless I expanded the Dolní Datyně article. I would be glad if you would "play with words" again. :) P.S. Can you reveal to me your first name? It would be kind of strange to say "hello milkbreath" to you :). Thank you. - Darwinek 22:09, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for copyediting and congrats on your new geographic article. It looks promising as for now but it seems you will still work on expanding it. You can call me Adam, Bryan. - Darwinek 01:28, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks also for copyedit of Havířov article. It seems to be OK now. I also created Gorolski Święto article today, I think it can be DYKed, so copyedit is needed again, please. :) - Darwinek 13:31, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

It is the name of this folklore group. It is exclusively men group which functions mainly as a choir. - Darwinek 18:22, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Political endorsements

I created a topic for discussion on the Zbigniew Brzezinski article's talk page and it addresses one of your actions, so I thought it would be a good idea to alert you to it. Alethiareg 00:27, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Karel Zich

Thanks :) ≈Tulkolahten≈^≈talk≈ 14:09, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the help!

Thanks for the copyedit help you've given me.

If you have a moment, could you take a look at Blue iguana? I'm about to bring it up for peer-review for good article nomination.

Thanks again Mike Searson 04:09, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Blue iguana

I think Fred Burton had started it. (He's done alot of research on the Blues on Grand Cayman and is cited 3 or 4 times in the article, he also uploaded the pic.) I basically tried rewriting some and adding the references and some of the more scientific prose (taxonomy section, etc) to change it from a BIRP puff piece. Thanks for the help, again! --Mike Searson 15:34, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Copyedit

Hello. I am back with new expanded article. Please look at Doubrava and play with words :). Any further questions direct to my talk page. Thank you. - Darwinek 12:35, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

PUT THAT BACK !

Both questions are not "spam", "inappropriate at all. BOTH started appearing on TV recently. One is a TV show, the other is about a possible scam. 65.163.112.225 18:46, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Offensive Usernames ?!

What is this and where at ? - In case I spot one. 65.163.112.225 00:58, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Need help?

Aloha! I see you've requested help.[2] What can we do? --Ali'i 12:56, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

With something like this, you may want to use the Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents. Hopefully you get things under control. We don't want people hurting themselves. Mahalo, Milkbreath. --Ali'i 13:04, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

About that one thing on ani

Don't just add praises on ani. Do it on peoples talk pages. If you want to make a thread there, let it be about an actual incident. Karnoff 05:24, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

deleting medical questions

On what basis did you make this edit? General medical questions are allowed. --JWSchmidt 13:59, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

"I am taking zinc" was what did it. <-- So you object to people describing their own behavior? If people are not allowed to mention their personal behaviors then why not make that a rule?
The guy clearly was asking, in earnest or not, whether he couldn't skip the flu shot this time and ride it out on the zinc alone. <-- That is your invention. "can zinc really act like the flu shot and really keep your body from getting the flu? If you take it on a daily basis will zinc really have that big of effect on the body to keep out the flu?" <-- Those are two general questions, not personal questions.
"The question was so idiotic that I believed he needs real help" <-- It sounds like you want a new rule: "do not ask questions that we think are idiotic". "Any answer at all amounts to medical advice" <-- Clearly not true. I think what you must mean is any answer might be taken as medical advice. Those are two different things.
"I would have thought it was obvious." <-- I think it is obvious that you either do not know what medical advice is or you do not care to make the distinction between medical advice and someone interpreting general information as medical advice. In any case, I do not think that removing questions such as this one is the best response. --JWSchmidt 15:11, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

I said: "'We aren't allowed to ask or answer medical questions' <-- this is not true". The guidelines clearly say that general medical questions are allowed. "calling me a liar" <-- I did not call you a liar. "I have lost interest in your opinion" <-- I think you have invented your own version of the ref desk guidelines and I find it disturbing that you are not even willing to listen when I point out you errors. "What are you doing?" <-- I think your approach to dealing with with the posted question(s) was not optimal, so I'm trying to repair the damage. --JWSchmidt 15:32, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

This is a bit surprising.. Having a few people judging me just because I asked an "idiotic" question "in your own opinions". Honestly though how is that a dumb question? I just asked if zinc could replace the flu shot as in not getting the flu. Zinc is a very powerful vitamin so I was just wondering if it could prevent another thing such as the flu. Zinc helps your body is so many different ways to keep it healthy so in a way it may seem obvious that it may prevent the flu. That is in my opinion though so I asked the question... I do not see a problem with that... And what is this about me needing some real help? That was just immature.. Bond Extreme 01:01, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Copyedit

Hello. Please check Hrádek (Frýdek-Místek District). It was expanded long time ago but I feel some copyedit would be needed. Thank you. - Darwinek 11:25, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. I removed "Godulian", it probably refers to the nearby mountain Godula but I am not sure. Maybe I will create article about it next year when I will purchase fresh book about our mountains and culture and legends associated with them. You are right, Bełko was a villain, so the "infamous" label is right here. Yeah, indeed, our history is very interesting and reading books about old times is always fine experience. Next summer I will probably have time to browse local archives for some old photos. Look for example at Pudlov article which already contains one vintage photograph. - Darwinek 21:33, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

Re Medical Question

Hello. Just to make this short I am not perfect... Yes I have read the Wikipedia guidelines but that was way back when I joined and there is room in that time frame to be forgetful about the rules. I will re read the rules but remember I am only human and can forget such things. Have a good one. :) Bond Extreme 00:51, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

I am not nescesarily mad but it is just so surprising that it is against the rules. I am irritated though at what people are saying about me in here though. Now I believe that is on the rules where you should not bash someone. But any way thank you for your concerns and do not worry about the romoval. It's all good. :) Bond Extreme 01:31, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Categories

Heh. I never took your page off my watchlist, and it was in the code. :p It was also still listed at the bottom, though I wasn't looking there. And... yeah, you also have the native English tag, so putting two English ones would be a bit silly anyhow. (Not that all native speakers have any idea how to use the language properly, but I can always pretend!) -Bbik^★ 21:22, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Your removal of a reference desk question

I don't feel that your removal of this question from the reference desk was appropriate. It contains many queries of a purely factual nature, and while it may provoke debate, it does not appear to be intended just to do so. See my (and User:DirkvdM's) further comments on the reference desk itself. -Elmer Clark 04:26, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Simply because the questions concerned a controversial subject doesn't mean they violated the debate rule - questions such as "Has any Iranian leader said explicitly that they want to build nuclear weapons?", "But hadn't George W. Bush said that Iran is part of the axis of evil? Did anyone condemn this statement outside the Islamic world?", "So have there been any concrete proof that it is the government of Iran that is supporting financially and militarily the Iraqi insurgency?", "How much connection is there between the Iranian governement and al-Qaeda operations in Iraq?," "So if US Americans are dissatisfied with their leaders, can't there be any option to have an election before the time it is normally expected?", etc, etc, are all questions of fact, which can be objectively answered. There are questions which I agree should be removed for this reason, but I think it should only be done on very explicit cases, and preferably not without gathering at least some consensus. And I didn't fail to assume good faith, I just thought you made an error in judgment. I'm glad this issue is settled, but I'd urge you to not take such actions in the future. -Elmer Clark 18:46, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I was just trying to clarify my comments, and point out that your statement that "The "question" was in violation of Reference desk guidelines concerning debate" was not true, as many questions of fact were indeed posed. I'm not sure what you're talking about regarding consensus - I was trying to suggest that in the future, when you or anyone else encounters a question that seems too "debate-oriented," it would be a good idea to voice your concern beneath the question and wait to see if other users agree before simply removing it. In this case, at least two editors (plus the questioner himself) opposed the removal of the question, so consensus did not exist. Regarding the "axis of evil" question, it may have been easily-answerable by following that link, but people ask questions they could easily find answers to themselves on the desk all the time - I don't understand at all how this "makes the question rhetorical." The many other questions of fact I listed, plus the others I didn't, still stand in any case.

If you'd like to open a broader discussion on the reference desk talk page, go ahead, but I'm not sure what you'd be trying to accomplish. Although you seem to have taken it rather poorly, I was just trying to give you some advice, it's your choice if you want to make a big issue of it. -Elmer Clark 20:17, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Congrats

Thank you for your congrats and nice words. :) - Darwinek 23:27, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

WikiHaquinator

Hello! I gather that you probably aren't an Administrator (don't ask me how I came up with this conclusion). You're the first person who's had a problem with my sig. (Don't get me wrong, I'm not making fun of you) The latter half is in referral to my talk page, and I have no intention of talking to anyone privately whatsoever. So don't worry about it! As they say, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". The Updater would like to talk to you! 09:24, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

No idea

Doh Ignore my last post. I'm an idiot. Theresa Knott | The otter sank 14:16, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Don't think I didn't notice!

I've got to go out now so I'll resume our heated debate on the ref desk later. However I noticed your new sig. Assuming it was inspired by mine I'm going to suggeast you consider "bleak mirth" instead as it is a genuine anagram of your username and also it's has IMO a poetic quality about it. Theresa Knott | The otter sank 15:00, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Good job

		The Resilient Barnstar
		For being bold on the reference desk. You saw something that you thought needed doing and you did it. The fact that other editors disagreed with the change does not diminish that. I wish all Wikipedia contributors were as bold. S.dedalus 04:17, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Good job on trying to follow the guidelines on ref desk. There is a long history there and, as you found, a mine field if you don' know the history. Having said that, to become the target of heated debated is not fair. You took it so well, resiliantly as implied above. My advice, just ignore them if they can't explain with patience. David D. (Talk) 20:10, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Belatedly: I too admired the way you handled the shower of cream pies flying toward you, and I now think my response, though hopefully not too impatient, might have been presumptuous. You never stop learning. I'm of very mixed feelings about the removals, personally, for various reasons, but I can appreciate the view of the conscientious trimmer and surgeon, and so much more than any shallow indignation wrapped in cries for "freedom-of-speech". A while ago, another user expressed the following sentiment at the desk:

"I'm encouraging us all to pull away from this ill considered warlike crap and just go on helping the folks who come here for our help. We always have the option to walk away from a trollish or uncomfortable question but, there are plenty more. I personally don't intend to get hung up on any bullcrap questions and further, if sufficiently egregious, I intend to delete, and you should do the same. Go to the talk page a week later and they'll still be debating your action so I ask you: who's ahead?" (2006) ---Sluzzelin talk 21:20, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Hi Sir, Thanks so much for your detailed answers to my question at the Language questions forum. I have one more question to ask. I will be posting it there soon. By the way, I am just learning the ways here. Found out now that I can talk to you on your "User talk". cheerio --Student club 04:34, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

Apologies

Dear Milkbreath, If I made the impression of wishing to shoulder you aside (Language Desk), that certainly was not my intention, and I'm sorry if I have been too expansive in putting forward my views on certain matters. Best regards, Bessel Dekker 17:17, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

• Thanks for you friendly reply (which, btw, was over-generous in that the contribution on rhoticity was not mine !) I must add that I have made you an accomplice in my evil ways now: I've just moved Debtor's prison (mentioned by yourself) back tot Debtors' prison. A book on Dickens encouragingly uses the latter spelling. Best regards, Bessel Dekker 17:56, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
  • Woodchopper's Ball is a nice one... might be a lonely affair though! Best regards, Bessel Dekker 21:08, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

Signature

"And you say you're not being rebellious..." I never said I wasn't being rebellious, I just said that wasn't my main objective. --MKnight9989 14:54, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

List of states by coastline

The new page looks very nice! Thanks. Cheers Geologyguy 15:33, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

185 BC

Hello!

Yes, you're right. I've made a minor re-phrasing and hope you like it better. If not, please change it. /Ludde23 ^{Talk Contrib} 10:17, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

Caps

please note that it is a long standing agreed convention that bird species names on Wikipedia are fully capitalised 07:01, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Actually, the people writing bird articles were almost unanimous on caps. The battle was with the rest of Wikipedia! Jimfbleak (talk) 14:51, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Being shocked by power lines and lightning

Thank you for your help. I'm still confused about a few things. I tried reading some of the articles here, but it's going way over my head. I think I can handle reading them after a few of my questions are answered.

Why can you be shocked by lightning even if you aren't grounded, but you won't be shocked by a power line as long as you aren't grounded? From what I understand, the basic idea between the power line and the lightning is the same. It's just electrons traveling through a medium, and you are getting in the way of the path of the electrons. I think the key to being shocked is having a different electrical voltage (pressure) than the electrons flowing through either the wire, or the air (in the case of lightning).

Steve Summit said you will get an inrush current when you touch a wire, and it will bring you up to the same voltage. But he said it is small, and presumably it isn't a sudden shock. Doesn't lightning do the same thing? When it hits you, even if you aren't grounded, it will bring you up to the same voltage. So why does the lightning shock you (when ungrounded), but touching the wire, while ungrounded, does not?

How many amps are usually flowing through the power lines? If you touch the wire when ungrounded, will the same amount of amps flowing through the power lines, also flow through you subtracting your body's electrical resistance?

If you are touching a power line, and you have 30,000 volts passing through you (and are ungrounded). Then someone comes and shoots a taser at you which is supposed to zap you with 30,000 volts. Would you feel anything? Since you are at the same voltage, you shouldn't feel anything right?

Thanks for your help. 64.236.121.129 (talk) 14:12, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Commas

Regarding The Raven: What justification have you seen that a "comma [is] invariably required after year in in-line date format Month DD, YYYY)"? I see nothing in the WP:DATES manual of style, and the several featured articles I briefly dug through don't utilize that style. As a writer myself, I've never heard such a rule. Not saying you're wrong, just looking for some justification. --Midnightdreary (talk) 04:36, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for doing some legwork on this question! I certainly wouldn't question the AP Stylebook, so thanks! --Midnightdreary (talk) 13:06, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Certainly. The AP Stylebook was my bible when I was teaching journalism... my point was that if it's in there, I can't dispute that the rule isn't legitimate one way or another! --Midnightdreary (talk) 14:22, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Talk:Ehime Maru and USS Greeneville collision

I've responded to your comment on the above talk page, and believe I've correct one of the ambiguous distances. Let me know which other distance wasn't labeled correctly and I'll see if I can find a source. - auburnpilot talk 00:31, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

MoS

It's wrong. Plain wrong. But whatever. - UtherSRG (talk) 14:59, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

Discussion about a reversion

I have engaged in discussion around the reversion of one of your edits at User talk:Fluri#Red Squirrel and MoS. I thought you should be informed lest you find your ears burning for no explicable reason. ;-) — Dave (Talk | contribs) 14:50, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Bladder Cancer

Hi Milkbreath. Re this.

I'm really surprised you'd say that, even in a joke, and even more surprised nobody else has taken exception to it. Is it just me? Can you help me out here? -- JackofOz (talk) 22:26, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

No worries, particularly now that it's gone anyway. What I read when I logged on was this:

• Questioner - OK, let's phrase it obviously as a physiology question. Multiple people have observed that if they refrain from urinating for too long, it is a bit difficult to start the flow going. These are healthy people with no relevant medical problems. What is the physiological basis for this delay?
• You - Undiagnosed bladder cancer.

I didn't see the original medical question, but the rephrasing as a general physiological question seemed fine to me. He made the point that he was talking about people with no relevant medical problems; so, replying with the name of a medical condition - any medical condition - seemed off the track for starters. But choosing "undiagnosed bladder cancer" in particular seemed to be going too far. If I went to the doctor complaining of being unable to get the flow going, the first thing he'd say would most definitely not be "I think you must have bladder cancer". Mentioning that condition in this context means that casual readers could pass by, read it, and immediately think (because the Ref Desk is world-renowned for its authority) they might have bladder cancer. Do you see the danger? I hope I'm not making too much out of this, but I thought it best to get this off my chest. Cheers -- JackofOz (talk) 05:39, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Posting an answer that's likely to scare the pants off the OP – whose only failure was in not reading the instructions at the top of the page – isn't a good way to respond to Jpgordon knowingly breaking the rules. I think Jack's given you a good talking-to about why the POINTyness if your response was not in good taste or in the best of judgement, so I won't belabour the point. I'll probably post a summary on WT:RD in a bit to do a proper post mortem of this whole sorry mess, but I'm very disappointed right now in the behaviour of a lot of people who are supposed to be responsible adults. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 17:16, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

On a completely personal level, I actually laughed out loud when I came to your response. Yeah, yeah, it wasn't in the best of taste, but it cut to the heart of the argument in a way that a "reasoned" argument can't. Risk of undiagnosed cancer is of course one of the most important reasons WHY we shouldn't answer medical questions in the first place. Matt Deres (talk) 17:33, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

You're very welcome. I suffer from the same excess of smartassery, so maybe it was easier for me to get the point. Ahh... life. Regards of the season to you as well. Matt Deres (talk) 19:01, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

Hawaii, USA

Thanks for the feedback. Your comments are well-taken. It's definitely not good for Americans to assume that everyone knows all of the various details about their country which they themselves take for granted. So I think it's fine to put "Hawaii, USA". My thought in changing it was that it's good to write as though readers are educated and literate, and in that way not speak down to them in a condescending manner. The kid in Nigeria with the $100 laptop will probably not know that Hawaii is in the United States at first, and it may be a little confusing. But as he reads other articles he'll learn about it just as we ourselves did when we were kids, and in the same way that we learned that Berlin is in Germany even though we're not necessarily German. Again, though, the points you make are valid ones. modify 11:37, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Chantix

Does it produce lapses of judgment? Are you inviting a medical or pharmacological opinion here? Best you speak to your relevant professional about possible side-effects, to see whether the drug in question is contra-indicated. If there are no known such side-effects, a visit to a psychiatrist might be something to think about.  :)

My question to you is, does Chantix work? I'm a smoker too, although I must confess I don't actually want to give up. That's a shockingly incorrect admission to make these days, I know, but it's the truth. Can I afford to smoke? No way. Does it do me any good? Of course not. Does it do harm? Undoubtedly. But is it utterly romantic? Yes, yes, a thousand times yes. The image of the bohemian writer ensconced in his country retreat away from the rat race, by a lake, tapping away all day long and into the small hours of the morning while enveloped in swirls of blue-grey cigarette smoke, drinking innumerable cups of tea/coffee/whisky, with only his beloved partner for company when he emerges from his cocoon - boy, that image is priceless. I have that as a reality, and I aim to keep it. But Hollywood has a hell of a lot to answer for, for putting it in my brain in the first place. I think particularly of Gregory Peck playing F Scott Fitzgerald in Beloved Infidel. Enough of my ramblings. Go in peace, Milkbreath. -- JackofOz (talk) 21:44, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Chantix triumphant

Hey. I got a little side-tracked, too. Great news about the smokes. When I decide that I actually want to give up, I might try Chantix too. Linda F, eh - I know her not, so I can't comment on how good you look in your dreams. Now, just what does "a guy like me" mean? -- JackofOz (talk) 08:00, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

Sounds like you're between a rock and a hard place. You wanted to give up, and you did, and you're happy about that. But at the same time you're not happy because you want not to have wanted to give up, even though you did want to give up. Don't try too hard to want not to have wanted to give up because you may get your wish, and that would be disastrous. Being an ex-smoker like you is far better than a guy like me whose main claim to fame is that he used to be an ex-smoker. Have a lungful of clean, fresh air for me, will you? And have a few extra dollars in your pocket each and every day for the rest of your life for me, will you? And have a longer life expectancy for me, will you? -- JackofOz (talk) 13:05, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

Les Invalides volley/organ/whatever gun

I noticed that my inquiry is now archived, so I thought I would check in with you if you had heard back from Les Invalides or not. Thanks. --BrokenSphere^{Msg me} 17:14, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

Yes, the pic (Image:Invalides-film136jpg.jpg) is on Commons. I took a pic of it myself when I visited 2 years ago which is a front view, but haven't uploaded it yet as I'm trying to determine what to call it. --BrokenSphere^{Msg me} 18:01, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

Verb tense

Re: Wikipedia:Reference desk/Language#Verb tense

Hello. You had contributed to the above discussion thread. Thanks. I wonder if I may ask you a follow-up question or two? First, to be honest, I can make neither heads nor tails out of what anyone said in that discussion. Can you simplify the concept in a way that I can understand? Thanks. Second, you confused me on one issue, as well. You seemed to make a distinction between saying that someone "set" a record versus "held" a record. Anyone who "sets" a record also "holds" the record ... no? Am I missing something? You seemed to make a critical distinction between the two, and I guess that I am not seeing it. Let's say that John Smith sets the record for most donuts ever eaten, at 100 donuts. John Smith sets the record and he also holds the record ... no? He is the record-setter and the record-holder ... no? Or are you simply saying that, after he sets the record --- yes, he is the record holder --- that is, until the next person breaks it. Is that what you meant? That setting a record is permanent while holding it is temporary? Thanks. If you choose to reply, please do so at my Talk Page. Thanks. (Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 01:37, 20 December 2007 (UTC))

Hi. You asked about the use of the past perfect in English. Lambiam was right, it is a difficult matter. Look at Pluperfect tense and Types of pluperfect. It is much easier to discuss grammar by means of examples than it is to bandy definitions about. Your examples were fine for that, except the one had a problem aside from tense. I hope you're not insulted by this question, but I have to ask you if English is your first language. It sometimes helps me explain things if I know what a person's first language is.

You wrote:

Example A:

John Smith broke the world record in 1973 by eating 100 donuts.

Prior to that, the record-holder was Joe Blow.

(OR) Prior to that, Joe Blow held the record by eating 50 donuts.

Example B:

John Smith broke the world record in 1973 by eating 100 donuts.

Prior to that, the record-holder had been Joe Blow.

(OR) Prior to that, Joe Blow had held the record by eating 50 donuts.

The third and sixth sentences above have a problem. Taking the third one: "Prior to that, Joe Blow held the record by eating 50 donuts." Idiomatically, you can't "hold" a record "by" doing something. For instance, you can't say that that Carl Lewis held the record by running fast. He might hold the record by virtue of fast running, or he might have set the record by running fast. To get back to your example, you could say "Prior to that, Joe Blow held the record of 50 donuts."

As for the past perfect, it is tempting to use it in your examples, I'll admit. I did think about my reply to your original question on the Language Desk the next day, and I think I got a better idea of the problem you're having.

Take B: "John Smith broke the world record in 1973 by eating 100 donuts. Prior to that, the record-holder had been Joe Blow." This is possible if you mean that Joe was the first and only holder of the record before John took it away. In other words, the record-holder had always been Joe Blow. But I don't think that the past perfect on its own is sufficient to convey that meaning unfailingly; we need the "always".

If you mean only that the man who held the record that John bettered was Joe, then you have to go with A: "Prior to that, the record-holder was Joe Blow." Your faulty sentence "Prior to that, Joe Blow held the record by eating 50 donuts" can be rendered correctly thus: "Prior to that, Joe Blow held the record." I can see how "prior" seems to set up the past perfect, and it sort of does. You could say "Only that morning, Joe had been the proud holder of the donut-eating record, and now, as he watched the sun set, it seemed to be taking all his hopes and dreams down with it." The past perfect steps an event back into the past from an existing past position. It's very temporal in that it emphasizes the sequence of events and keeps them in the same time frame with each other. The fact that Joe held the record before John took it is already known; we don't need to signal the sequence with the verb tense. That's what I meant when I said "Only use the past perfect when you need to."

This stuff is hard to write about and be clear. Please don't hesitate to ask for clarification of any of the above. I strive for clarity in my writing, and I appreciate any feedback I can get. --Milkbreath (talk) 04:02, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for all your help above. I will get back to you on this. No free time at present, though. Thank you. (Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 20:13, 27 January 2008 (UTC))

Merry Christmas

Darwinek wishes you a Merry Christmas!

Hello! I wish you a Merry Christmas and all the best in the new year. Looking forward for cooperation in 2008. - Darwinek (talk) 11:54, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Hi! I have some time during the holiday season, so I expanded the Orlová article, struggling with English as always. :) Please have a look and make proper copyedit. - Darwinek (talk) 20:53, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Thank you. I have clarified it. I would like to nominate it to DYK section. Do you have ideas for some catchy phrase? - Darwinek (talk) 09:38, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. I have submitted it. Do you add to watchlist my articles you copyedit? - Darwinek (talk) 17:05, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

Nice, you can always copyedit my articles when I will expand them further. --Darwinek (talk) 17:54, 24 December 2007 (UTC)- Darwinek (talk) 17:54, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

Hello again. I have significantly expanded Cieszyn Silesia article and nominated it for DYK. Please, look and copyedit. Btw. all of my geographical expansions refer to towns and villages of this region. So, this is kind of central article. I also plan in future to link it with all the municipalities by revamping the template you can find at the bottom of that article. - Darwinek (talk) 14:27, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

Thank you very much, it is much better now. Well, the border issue is quite complicated, and I would love to include it in the article but I would need to get some exact sources. From what I know, right after the 1920 division thousands of families were divided by the border and several municipalities were divided also (I will probably add it to the article). You needed then to buy a permission to go to your grandma in the village one kilometre from your home. After World War II, during the communist era you also needed a permission and tight border controls (even humiliating, when you was stripped to the underwear) were enacted. There was also a year limit in the number of permissions. Even worse was the situation during the Prague Spring and Martial law in Poland. After the fall of communism you wouldn't need a permission but still border controls existed. They softened during the time and in the last years you just crossed the border and policemen just looked to your passport or ID card. And now, thank God, we are in the Schengen Zone and you can cross the borders anywhere you want without the documents, just like before 1920 when the region wasn't divided yet. It is very important for our region and mainly older people feel this strongly. There was a big border party week ago, several thousands people from both sides of the border gathered and celebrated it. - Darwinek (talk) 12:05, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

Favor

You have done alot of copyediting for articles that I have created or contributed to and the quality of your work has been excellent. Now I ask a favor; I am reviewing an article for GA and I've put it on hold, guidelines state that I must review by a week from putting it on hold, the week will pass tomorrow and the article has improved on sources and formatting, but there's one thing missing; you guessed it! A copyedit, I would've put it up at the league, but I really don't have much time, I myself am not very good at copyediting, so I was wondering whether you could give the article a good scan for language, it's not very long. If you could squeeze it into your wiki-schedule then thanks!--The Dominator (talk) 03:35, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

		The Copyeditor's Barnstar
		For your excellence in copyediting and your willingness to help other editors, I award you this barnstar, I hope I got that grammar right The Dominator (talk) 05:56, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Hehe, you're grammar is good to.--The Dominator (talk) 15:52, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Hey Milkbreath, I was wondering whether you could check out CTWG again, there appear to be some prose issues that are preventing the article from being promoted. There are some suggestions at Wikipedia:Featured article candidates#Connecticut Wing Civil Air Patrol. Thanks. The Dominator (talk) 03:44, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks a lot. The Dominator (talk) 14:12, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Naughty George

Just when things were getting serious, thanks for making me laugh at the thought of George W (ashington) sleeping around! : )) Julia Rossi (talk) 10:33, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

That's enough

Accusing someone of 'whining' and 'trolling' ([3]) just because they used a slightly over-the-top reductio ad absurdum argument is entirely uncalled-for. I hope that you haven't gotten the mistaken impression that anon IP's are fair game for abuse. Disagree civilly or not at all. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 18:09, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Come now, do you really engage in full-on 'tit for tat' in your daily life outside of Wikipedia? From a game theoretic approach, it's suboptimal, leading to a death spiral of mutual retribution if – even by accident – one party steps on the other's toes. See tit for tat and examine the strategic variants that incorporate 'forgiveness'.

Even then, if you look at your comment objectively, 'tweren't 'tit for tat' that you employed, but an escalation to a borderline personal attack—which you've continued on my talk page ('trollishness', 'petulant', 'whining'). The IP apparently thought (correctly or not) that you might have missed his point; his response contained a bit of hyperbole, but didn't attack you or your character.

Bear in mind as well that he started out with a somewhat legitimate beef. Nobody deleted one of your comments. Whether the deletion was right or wrong, it's not that surprising that the comment's author would feel a bit irked. That's not a free pass for obnoxious conduct, but it may cause us to consider cutting a bit more slack than usual. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 20:15, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

I don't understand what you're trying to say in your reply. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 22:09, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

I know I'm butting in here, Milkbreath, but I just wanted to say that I love your description of "gratuitous italics" as "whining"!--Eriastrum (talk) 20:28, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Help Request

{{helpme}}

Hi there! You recently placed the {{helpme}} tag on this page. What do you need help with, what is your question? Feel free to respond here or on my talk page. Best regards! --omtay38 17:23, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Hello! First and foremost, I would strongly encourage you remain civil. Even joking can often cause unneeded hostility and can often be read as a personal attack. As for the article you are talking about, could you perhaps provide a link to the article and the other user involved in this dispute? --omtay38 17:37, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Again, please remain civil (I refer to "one registered user complains about the conduct of another"). Believe me, being as kind as possible (even in the heat of argument) will help you immensely in the future. There is no place to "complain" about another user, but we do have Dispute resolution which allows you to resolve conflicts between editors. Again, be sure you read it all very carefully. I've seen too many users blocked for losing their heads over simple editing disagreements. Hope this helped! If you need anything else, let me know! --omtay38 17:49, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

I do not doubt your intentions at all. Perhaps a better phrasing would have been "I was wondering if there was a place where one user could discuss the removal of a tag from an article." It's sort of a wikipedia thing to assume good faith and think that the user had a reason to remove a tag. It's always best to discuss the action a user performed, not the user him/herself. I've also found some more information about POV tags that you might find useful here. Hope this helped! --omtay38 18:07, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Coincidence?

m i l k b r e a t h

l e t h i m b a r k

(har har. Anyway, your milkbark is far worse than your milkbite, and appreciated.)

---Sluzzelin talk 19:43, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

War: Mmm, i was hoping the picture of the nuclear bomb would stop that thread. But your last post there will give it a new lease of life, don't you think? I thought you want to delete it? Or is this your strategy to that end :) David D. (Talk) 20:07, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

potrero hills comment

I think you missed the fact that "Chevron Richmond Refinery" is a name, all three words. Would you check back and see all the comments and links at talk:Potrero Hills?Boomgaylove (talk) 01:38, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Perplexing sentence

Mille grazie! I like your paraphrase.LShecut2nd (talk) 18:22, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Re.:Ref desk, misc: Cancerproject.org as a PETA ad

I heard this as a ad while listening to Coast To Coast AM. The ad claimed that meat will give you cancer and no telling what the hell else, make you fat, that kind of shit. The ads started last night, and may air again tonight during the Coast To Coast AM show, which airs at 12m CDT/CST Sun-Sat. Hope you're a night owl or work nights, so that you can hear this sick ad for yourself. 65.173.105.203 (talk) 00:10, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Use the website to locate any radio stations near you to "catch" that show. 65.173.105.203 (talk) 00:12, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Speaker impedance

Hey, you responded to my reference desk question about speaker impedance. If I wired the speakers in series, doesn't that double the impedance, and wouldn't a double in impedance send the power back to the receiver and fry the unit? Also, wouldn't it make it half as loud as running it in parallel? Is it true that running it in parallel like I have it now could potentially damage something if I turn it up too loud? I'm asking all this cause I really would not like to find out the hard way. NIRVANA2764 (talk) 21:51, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Frankness

Re reply Ted Bundy philospher refdesk. Thanks for making me laugh. I want to hear a real-world librarian talk like that sometimes. Julia Rossi (talk) 01:31, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Roderick Jaynes unmasked

Too right. Fargo forever. Credits roll: Editor... ... .... M. Ilkbreath. Look forward to it. ; ) Julia Rossi (talk) 22:39, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

drug induced fits

hi there milkbreath, i never intended to sound mocking, i don't know what your drug experince is, but in mine i have witnessed drug induced fits and was merely trying to pass on this knowledge. Perry-mankster (talk) 19:59, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Prague Spring

Hey, it's me being annoying again. I really didn't want to bother you this time, but as fate would have it, I couldn't find another competent copyeditor. So that brings me here; I was wondering whether you could take a look at Prague Spring as you have worked on it in the past and I really wish to nominate it for FA in the next few days. Also, if you would find any other major problems with the article just comment on its talk. If you're too busy, don't worry about it, just respond on my talk that you're not able to fulfill my request. Thanks for all the help Milkbreath! The Dominator (talk) 15:40, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Left comments on talk, rewrote lead. The Dominator (talk) 16:41, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

your vandalism

I suppose that excluding potential references from my research is better than to include those which have been provided by an organization which allows itself to be manned by those with a perspective which is clearly one sided. Multimillionaire (talk) 14:21, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

[The above is a message from a troll. Please ignore it. I did.] --Milkbreath (talk) 14:23, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Copyediting

Hello. Are you still available for some copyediting work? - Darwinek (talk) 15:14, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Great! Please look at Karol Piegza article. The language is somewhat rough, including one quote translated in amateur way. - Darwinek (talk) 15:35, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

tyop

Was your recent edit summary at Wikipedia:Reference desk/Science a misteak, or were you being ironic? 'Tis the day for it. Either way, it made me smile. — kwami (talk) 19:43, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Main Page Nomination for Manzanar

With the 39th Annual Manzanar Pilgrimage coming up on April 26, I have nominated Manzanar to be on Wikipedia's main page on that date. Please add your support for that at Today's featured article requests -- Gmatsuda (talk) 20:23, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

Finally got an open slot. Feel free to add your support! -- Gmatsuda (talk) 16:01, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

Devon stream name

I read your profile. If I had known that you were a filthy atheist, I never would have helped you. You will burn in hell. As sure as there is a god, you will burn in hell! --David from Downunder (talk) 08:24, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Dammit man, I'm sorry - I shouldn't assume you hadn't bathed! --David from Downunder (talk) 10:27, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

I would have felt better, but I just stubbed my toe. --David from Downunder (talk) 11:16, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

You could at least brush your teeth. --David from Downunder (talk) 11:59, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

One way or another, I'm goanna gethca getcha getcha getcha. --David from Downunder (talk) 12:25, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

Ahh... she's mighty purdy ain't she?! But say anything bad about her hairdo and she'll send her baaa-rristers around to your place for a spot of midget bullying. --David from Downunder (talk) 12:02, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

T-word

Milkbreath, I think you ought to be careful about using words such as "trolling", "troll", and "trollery" that lightly when describing the actions of regular and good-faith editors; it's sort of reserved for those who are deliberately trying to waste our time, or deliberately trying to disrupt the desks. That's not what Atlant was doing, even if he might have been soapboxing. Wikipedia:What is a troll? is not a bad essay. ---Sluzzelin talk 16:03, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Don't mention the war!

Mate... you'd better watch out! --David from Downunder (talk) 02:23, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

George Washington Caldwell

Just wrote an article on John Caldwell (Michigan State Representative) who was given the name George Washington Caldwell at birth because he was born on the Fourth of July. Appreciate any tweaking you might have time for. Also submitted for DYK. Thanks. --Doug ^talk 22:42, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Machetes at forty paces

Milkbreath – just using the words humble and pray, you made me laugh. You got your answer, a bot-goddess! Put muscles on that rosette article now, y'heah?  : ) Julia Rossi (talk) 12:36, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

And thanks for the tea!  ; ) JR

Not Logging in With Ano names?

Cardster? I do not reply with ano. names. I reply with the same name as I always do, Cardinal Raven. I haven't logged in most of the time because I pressed on time, but I have a thought going through my head. It makes it much easier when I just ask the question and have a sigh of relief knowing when I come back I can get a help. Or I have an answer to someones question and I want to reply. This week has been very busy for me. The reason I don't log on when I don't have enough time is because my computer is extremely slow. So I just want to answer or ask the question quickly. Oh and I never reply that quickly. I don't reply soon after. I reply whenever there is a computer next to me. I'm kinda addicted to learning. I hope this has help you understand much more. I hope you have a good day.

Always

Cardinal Raven

Cardinal Raven (talk) 03:27, 27 April 2008 (UTC)Cardinal Raven

Crocodile wife

Thanks to your answer I was able to write a snappy stub.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 11:31, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

I agree it doesn't really fit, as the fisherman remains alive and well. And Mohamed Al-Fayed of course hails from Egypt where they have lots of crocs. I shall look to see if there is an Egyptian folklore portal where someone might have an idea.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 13:01, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

Re: "Chalk it up"

Thanks, I thought I had misspelled it, but I wasn't sure how. And despite the name and the inferences I made, English is my first language, I just dislike the language since it's very illogical and if it wasn't my first language I would despise trying to learn it.--十八 19:57, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Formation and evolution of the Solar System

About this edit - please read Talk:Formation and evolution of the Solar System#Lead section, there was a reason for the disclaimer and no, it would not "need to be in practically every sentence throughout." Cerebellum (talk) 13:39, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Since another user carried out the edit (the "silence the creationists" comment was his, by the way; I'm a creationist myself) I thought that represented some degree of consensus; it appears I was wrong, and that's fine with me. You guys are the editors who brought this to FA, so I'll leave you to it. I'm supposed to be mowing the lawn, anyway. ; ) Cerebellum (talk) 14:39, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

weird...and wrong {**cringe**}

In my haste (since any Wikipedia activity at present, as I'm facing a looming deadline, can barely be justified even as therapeutic), it seems I was rather slipshod in one of my recommendations on that query just now. That's what happens when I offer hurried help to an ELF OP; I kept my response at the word level rather than digging into the entire phrase at that point. Being a professional editor, this note to you is by way of mea culpa and behind-the-scenes explanation... and to express thanks for your thoughful and conscientious attention to fellow editors' slips! -- Sincerely, Deborahjay (talk) 12:56, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Your next word in Hungarian

You wrote: "...I'm so proud of myself; I ordered "tap water" in Hungarian, and they brought some!"
Conclusion: Learn words for other things you'd like brought to you.  ;-)
Testimony: Some two decades back, I worked as a sort of scullery maid in a commercial kitchen among whose cooks were several native speakers of Hungarian.The only word in that bizarre language I managed to learn was krumpli. So if you or I ever wind up sojourning there, we won't perish of starvation or thirst! -- Deborahjay (talk) 14:06, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Jurassic Park (film)

		The Copyeditor's Barnstar
		Thank you so much for copyediting Jurassic Park, a day before its appearance on the main page! Alientraveller (talk) 16:36, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

I'm a lunatic? I almost want to reverse time and not award you... nah, I know you're calling me lively. Double thanks. Alientraveller (talk) 17:07, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Howdy, Milkbreath. I replied to your post at Talk:Jurassic Park (film). I wasn't trying to be a jerk, but I feel that you were coming on slightly stronger there than is strictly justified. -- 201.37.229.117 (talk) 13:41, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Yowza re Nuni

		The Reference Desk Barnstar
		Better late than never! This barnstar is awarded for your exemplary work in tracking down the answer to the obscure question, Who were the Nuni? It took weeks, but you never gave up. You took the springboard of collective cleverness and added a healthy dose of diligence and persistence by playing with ideas, using your Google-fu, and finally ordering the right book from your library. Your research turned up the correct answer. The real joy lies in that success, of course, but this barnstar is awarded to remind you of your triumph. BrainyBabe (talk) 22:48, 16 July 2008 (UTC)

At what point does a break become abandonment?

Seriously, where are you? Zain Ebrahim (talk) 20:52, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

Candide (again)

About a year ago you wrote the following on my talk page:

“ I saw on your userpage that "Candide" is next on your list. Does that mean you intend to rewrite and strengthen the article? Woo-hoo! After the torture of copyediting it, I'm very nearly inspired to take it in hand myself, because none of the experts cited (or the writer) seem to have a very good idea what it is. Everybody seems to forget that Voltaire was smarter than we are, whoever we think we are. I can't wait to see what you do with it. ”

I thought I'd update you on my work on it... Candide is currently an FAC, and it's nearing the end of the list with 2 supporting users and no active objections! Whether it passes or fails, I'd like to thank you for your help with the article so long ago. -- Rmrfstar (talk) 23:09, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

Welcome back

Nice to see your name up there in lights again, welcome Milkbreath : ) Julia Rossi (talk) 04:59, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

And so you are! My special thanks to Linda :) Julia Rossi (talk) 05:09, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Metric and IMperial measurements

Instead of making edits like this, please use {{convert}}. Thank you. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 13:06, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

Go Man Go

You are aware that you just reverted for the third time? And that Thoroughbred is in fact a proper name for the breed? As is Quarter Horse? Note that our breed article on Quarter Horse is capitalised in both words. The Merriam-Webster Handbook of English Usage uses Thoroughbred, not thoroughbred, when referring to the breed. 17:06, 5 January 2009 (UTC)Ealdgyth - Talk

Please do not reinsert your changes again, or you could be blocked for a violation of the three-revert rule. The appropriate next step is to dicuss the issue on Talk:Go Man Go and provide sourcing for your preferred capitalization. Karanacs (talk) 17:11, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, I saw your post to Ealdgyth's talk page after I left this. It's always best to discuss matters when there is a disagreement - good luck resolving it! Karanacs (talk) 17:13, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Turn the other cheek

While I certainly wouldn't touch the current discussion – which has descended into mean-spirited mudslinging and is rapidly falling out of sight of reality – I feel it might be wise to hand you a fire extinguisher.

Accusations or even suggestions of vandalism ([4]) are not taken lightly or kindly by editors. While StuRat's section header change is quite WP:POINTy (and it breaks the section anchor for readers who hop over from a contribution list or the page history — and he's been asked before not to do that sort of thing), it's probably best to ignore.

If you feel it is important then you can restore the original header, but add either a third-level header (=== Like this ===) or an HTML anchor (<div id="like_this"/>) so as not to break StuRat's links. (Remember to replace the spaces in the anchor text with underscores.)

Honestly, I'd recommend just letting the bad-faith nastiness burn itself out and slide off the watchlists. That thread has gone too far and gotten too personal to be recoverable into something useful. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 15:56, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

new WP:RDREG userbox

This user is a Reference desk regular.

The box to the right is the newly created userbox for all RefDesk regulars. Since you are an RD regular, you are receiving this notice to remind you to put this box on your userpage! (but when you do, don't include the |no. Just say {{WP:RD regulars/box}} ) This adds you to Category:RD regulars, which is a must. So please, add it. Don't worry, no more spam after this - just check WP:RDREG for updates, news, etc. flaminglawyer^c 21:52, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Convert

It's complicated to say the least. User:Jimp is the best person to ask. However, he's not around much.

Besides looking at the code for {{convert}}, check out {{Convert/unit}}. That will give you a good basic overview of what's what...(maybe). —MJCdetroit ^(yak) 12:42, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

French "out of office" on the language reference desk

Hi, reading my reply again on the language reference desk, I think it may have been interpreted as a blunt and offensive comment to joeldl's own reply just above, I just want to make it clear the "clumsy translation" bit was refering to the original translation being questioned. Equendil Talk 02:46, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

Adminhelp request

{{adminhelp}} I don't want to be an edit-warrer, but I do want to crush blatant POV-pushing in a certain case. I've been reverted, not selectively, either, both the NPOV and the non-NPOV parts of my edit, just a blanket revert. What is the next step, other than undoing the revert until I get threatened with a block? (Doesn't the three-revert rule favor article ownership?) --Milkbreath (talk) 11:19, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Please tell me which article you are referring to. 3RR does not favor ownership as it applies to the creator as well and usually they revert thrice before you do. As a general answer, I'd say request dispute resolution or raise the issue at the neutrality noticeboard. Regards SoWhy 11:53, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Here's the diff: diff. --Milkbreath (talk) 12:00, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

I see. Well, my suggestion stands, raise the issue at Talk:Marie Curie to talk to the user who undid your edits and try to understand why they did so (see Talk:Marie Curie#Requested_move especially which deals with the name). If they are unwilling to provide further reasoning or refuse to talk, pursue dispute resolution for example by requesting a third opinion or requesting for comments. Regards SoWhy 14:11, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Washington, D.C. commas

Dear Milkbreath,

Thank you for your edits at Washington, D.C. Your efforts are much appreciated, however, it is not necessary to add a comma after "D.C." in every instance. Such punctuation is not required by Wikipedia's Manual of Style and, in fact, WP:COMMA indicates that modern practice is to use fewer commas, not more. Thanks again. Best, epicAdam^(talk) 15:28, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Unfortunately, I do not agree with your assessment. Wikipedia does not follow any particular style guide and grammatical issues such as this follow consensus. The current article consensus is to leave the comma out. The comma is particularly noticeable in several instances, especially when its addition creates awkward phrasing. For example, the addition of a comma in "If Washington, D.C., were a state," transforms "were a state" into an apposition. That, of course, is incorrect. I would therefore ask that you not singularly overturn the article's long-standing consensus. Thank you. Best, epicAdam^(talk) 15:46, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

No, the comma doesn't change the grammar. And consensus doesn't change reality. That comma is mandatory. Let a copyeditor do his job, please. --Milkbreath (talk) 15:52, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

On Wikipedia, consensus absolutely does change reality, at least as it pertains to articles. The comma is not mandatory per any policy or guideline on Wikipedia and I believe it absolutely changes the grammar. If you wish to change consensus, you can open a talk discussion and allow other editors to comment. Best, epicAdam^(talk) 16:00, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

I've left a note to that effect on your talk page. See you in article space. By the way, I found the article in much better shape copyedit-wise that most featured articles I tackle. Kudos. --Milkbreath (talk) 16:04, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Thank you for your kind assessment. Your edits definitely made the article better, even if we do disagree about commas! I also apologize if I come off as taking ownership of the article, it's not my intention. Best, epicAdam^(talk) 16:30, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Champroux

Dear Milkbreath, I appreciate your pitching in on my Humanities Ref Desk query, with information and its source. As our archival work involves quite a lot of verification of place names, your introducing me to the NGA GEOnet Names Server (GNS) is quite astonishing and valuable, so special thanks are due you for that. I'm optimistic it will help us in clarifying the names of unpopulated locales (e.g. forests in Eastern Europe where massacres took place during WWII) that are lacking in conventional gazetteers. A first trial with a known place (Cudine in the Torino region) was disappointing, but I'm determined to use it again and again. -- Cheers, Deborahjay (talk) 08:47, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Milkbreath. You have new messages at The ed17's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

—Ed 17 ^{(Talk / Contribs)} 02:29, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

I hereby order you to watchlist my talk page for replies. :D —Ed 17 ^{(Talk / Contribs)} 03:32, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

Opinions/business

You're very welcome, Milkbreath, but I can't claim credit. It was virtually a mantra among the personal development crowd I hung around with for a while back in the '90s. It's a good way of thinking about disassociating oneself from the opinions and expectations of others, which, if you let it, can be a dreadful burden. Best. How's that lactohalitosis going, by the way?  :) -- JackofOz (talk) 22:55, 5 February 2009 (UTC)

Achtung!

ROFL at that one, Milkbreath. The implications and now breaking up over any typo. Very funny, from the facist one, :))

HI THERE

I READ YOUR RESPONSE ON LEAKING CEILING.

ACTUALLY I AM RESIDING ON GROUND FLOOR OF A 3 STOREY APARTMENT.

THE HOUSE ON 1ST FLOOR ABOVE ME HAS ITS BATHROOM LEAKING IN MY HOUSE & THE OWNER IS NOT WILLING TO MAKE REPAIRS & NEITHER ALLOWING ME TO DO SO.

IS THERE ANY WAY TO SORT OUT THIS PROBLEM? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Saurabh85 (talk • contribs) 12:15, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

THANKS!

THANKS TO REPLY & ALSO TO WELCOM.

ACTUALLY WE BOTH OWN OUR APARTMENT. SO THERE IS NO LANDLORD IN THE CASE.

ANYWAY THANKS FOR YOUR SUGGESTION, WILL POST MY QYERY AS YOU SAID. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Saurabh85 (talk • contribs) 10:00, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

revision

hello! thanks A LOT for your help with Brazilian art!!!!!! great job! my best regards! Ricardofrantz (talk) 10:18, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

Enchanté

Hi Milkbreath – glad to help. But you beat me to messaging: I just sat down to congratulate you on your nice translation work. Weird, that thing happening where the "foreign" language takes over your own. I'm happy to be the extra pair of eyez anytime. Wanted to anglicise more but not right away when you've just put in the hard lines. Any chance of stealing the french infobox? Will you try for a DYK? or would you like to be nominated – just say, if it qualifies, natch Julia Rossi (talk) 12:56, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

I'm happy to acquiesce/collaborate/be in cahoots with anything you'd like to go for. Feel free to hack on any article you like anytime; nobody owns an article, and I welcome assistance especially apres translation. I don't concern myself much with the ways of the wiki; I like to show off on the refdesks and copyedit to feed my obsession for sticking my nose in where it's not wanted. Nominate for what? --Milkbreath (talk) 14:31, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

The article had thngs like la maison du théâtre so went about making things uniform. Don't know what the mos recommends, but if you like, kill 'em all. Nominate for Did You Know – it probably needs citations though, especially for any hook. Julia Rossi (talk) 22:46, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Tried to undo my diacritics eds but it won't allow them via the undo button. dang. Julia Rossi (talk) 01:34, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

'K. :)

help

"Re your comment on the Reference Desk, feel free to call on me any time for anything"

i will, for sure! thanks for you kindness! regards!! Ricardofrantz (talk) 01:16, 22 February 2009 (UTC)

hello buddy! could you improve the English language in these articles? Brazilian sculpture and Brazilian painting. no hurry, and you may change anything you find wrong or dull. regards! Ricardo Frantz (talk) 05:03, 27 February 2009 (UTC)

hi Milkbreath! you did a great job again! thank you very much !!!!!!!!!!

as of Baroque's 3rd section, maybe this reading would be clearer... what do you think?

Two special genres of sculpture deserve mention in the Baroque period. 1: The missionary sculpture, and 2: the articulated pieces used in plays and processions, the so-called de roca statues. The first one flourished in the Reductions and was produced by Indians, often helped by Jesuit missionaries, as part of the Jesuit's educative method of teaching religion to the Indians, who were deeply impressed and moved by European art. Its style is a very original synthesis of European influences with the native vision. This production is of great interest because of both its plastic quality and its unique flavor. Although the largest part of it disappeared, either sold abroad, reshaped or destroyed, many pieces do remain, preserved mainly by the Missions Museum in Rio Grande do Sul, and they are now National Heritage. As of the de roca statues, they were also sacred in nature, and shared a common purpose with the missionary art as both were intended to be educative. Manipulated by puppeteers in plays of sacred character, they were instrumental for exciting piety in the people, enhancing the dramatic effect of the play. They were also commonly carried by chariots or other movable devices along processions.

Ricardo Frantz (talk) 02:38, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

thanks for you help with Brazilian art!!!! by the way, see here for learning about de roca statues Ricardo Frantz (talk) 06:27, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

Medical advice. Again.

Hi Milkbreath. I know you are a ref desker who takes a hard line on medical advice questions. I removed something I thought was pretty clear cut and now the usual suspects are complaining about it. I think there are some real problems with certain editors feeling ownership of the ref desk. Where does an editor get off telling me what was right and wrong about my removal of a question? What's next, a report card? Will I be called to the principal's office? I'm not sure where I want to go from here. My first reaction is to go off the deep end, which I know would not be constructive. But I feel insulted by StuRat's response. What are your thoughts? - Eron^Talk 18:31, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, well, I feel your pain. I remain hopeful about the potential of Wikipedia, but I do share your concerns about cranks and POV pushers of all stripes. I'll just keep sticking my fingers in the dike, trying my best to prevent bad information from driving out the good and hoping that someone can recognize the difference. - Eron^Talk 22:35, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Someone left you a message...

...at my User talk page. That someone being User:Shabeki, to whom I responded thus. I prefer to conduct discussions (or not) of Islamic terror with the locals in real life, so correspondingly decline to do so in electronic forums. Given the stuff I deal with online with depressing frequency, I hope my reluctance to step up to the virtual plate on this present topic will be excused. Otherwise, I look forward to your ongoing contributions and our future cooperative enterprise. -- Cheers, Deborahjay (talk) 10:45, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Happy Milkbreath's Day!

Milkbreath has been identified as an Awesome Wikipedian, and therefore, I've officially declared today as Milkbreath's day! For your excellent work as a RefDesk regular, enjoy being the Star of the day, Milkbreath! Cheers, bibliomaniac15 23:10, 6 May 2009 (UTC) If you'd like to show off your awesomeness, you can use this userbox.

Hook needed

Hello. Your DYK suggestion needs work. Please see the DYK page. Thank you. -SusanLesch (talk) 19:44, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

To be more specific, we need a hook for your suggestion of Syd'Quan Thompson. -SusanLesch (talk) 20:40, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

A thousand pardons! -SusanLesch (talk) 21:02, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

Re Battle of Muong Khoua

Thank you for your comments and for your copy editing on the above article, much appreciated. And yes, you do need to get a better hang on the whole politeness thing. Regards, SGGH ^ping! 13:03, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

Oh, let the fish die already

What? Let's be very clear: I don't think there's something wrong with you for missing my point, I just think that you missed it; I also genuinely think you've not read a part in my posts, or otherwise part in your posts would not make much sense. My message can't possibly be read to say that you are stupid, it reads exactly like I meant it to read: that you are wrong. It's both pretentious and unreasonable to assume that being polite = not saying one is wrong. And, yes, I have continued to post after your "last word", but this was not to "score points" (?!). It was because the purpose of my posts there, and the finality of all posts there, is the hook itself - in my view, too many hooks with problems get by, and I would want that to cease. Evidencing those problems and how people fail to consider them problems is what my posts are all about. Also, expecting a "last word" not to be commented upon is illusory.

And, no, I'm not and was not angry. Granted, in this case and many others in the past, I've found it quite frustrating that there are people who think the only arguments against their views can only be voiced in anger. That is the equivalent of covering one's years and starting to hum.

In short: I don't believe I have produced any insult aimed at you, nor did I mean to. You may feel insulted by some phrasing (again, with no intention on my part), and you have definitely read a tone of my voice in them where there was none. For what it's worth, you have my apologies for that. Dahn (talk) 11:23, 6 August 2009 (UTC)