User talk:HRSmith77

Come and take it - thank you, but...

Thank you for your edit, which I'm sure was made in all good faith. However, I have a few comments.

Molon labe apparently means 'come and take [them]' - "come and take", with singular or plural being implied not specified. The point of referring to a recorded ancient antecedent of the modern English phrase is to put things into context. Very obviously, a laconic and defiant answer such as that given by Leonidas in 480 BC long predates the development of the English language - and, equally obviously, knowledge of ancient Greek history which is and was commonplace in Europe would have fed into wider European culture with all that implies, including informing the European language speakers who presented the same defiance during the American and Texan Revolutions over the other side of the Atlantic. An encyclopaedia is supposed to encompass all knowledge. There's really no excuse for cutting out relevant information.

You say that "the intent of the article is to explain the origin of the use of the English phrase and not primarily to address use of terms of similar meaning in other languages" - if your claim be true, then the Leonidas reference absolutely must be kept because Leonidas's remark is the recorded origin. Just because Greece is in the bottom right hand corner of Europe and England (the source of the English language many centuries later) is nearer the top left doesn't mean there's no cultural and linguistic connection. Consider: back when the USA was founded by European immigrants or their descendents, Greece was generally viewed by Europeans as the cradle of civilization, and studied as such in schools.

Consider also: in 1778, the written American revolutionary response to a British demand to surrender was "As to surrendering the fort, receive this laconic reply: COME AND TAKE IT!". Laconic reply? "A laconic phrase or laconism is a concise or terse statement, especially a blunt and elliptical rejoinder. It is named after Laconia, the region of Greece including the city of Sparta, whose ancient inhabitants had a reputation for verbal austerity and were famous for their often pithy remarks."

In other words, the first recorded use of the phrase by an American using the English language includes an explicit reference to ancient Sparta - really, the opening lines talking about the ancient Spartan origin of the phrase can't be deleted if that's to make any sense, can they?

(Yes, I'm English. Sorry. It's not my fault, it just happened.)

Michael F 1967 (talk) 00:34, 1 April 2024 (UTC)