User talk:GloryRoad66/Archive 2

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Welcome!

Hello, Garagepunk66, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place {{help me}} before the question. Again, welcome! --IllaZilla (talk) 19:04, 27 October 2012 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

The Music Machine
For being a true representive of a great era of music. Thanks for improving multiple pages related to 60s music, especially the garage rock article. TheGracefulSlick (talk) 22:26, 28 April 2015 (UTC)

This is long overdue, continue the amazing work! TheGracefulSlick (talk) 22:28, 28 April 2015

Thank you so much. Your recognition means a lot to me, considering all of the articles that you have created and improved. Garagepunk66 (talk) 20:01, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

Honestly, the short time we have collaborated together has helped me improve on my editing skills significantly, so part of the credit should go to you. Without you and Ghmyrtle, I don't think I would have been able to contribute as much as I hoped I could. TheGracefulSlick (talk) 16:33, 29 April 2015

I should be able to complete my article on Wimple Winch by tomorrow (so excited!) so I should be getting back on track, regarding article creating. I have been so involved in the death of Freddie Gray though, unrelated to music, I realize, that I got a little off task. Hope your plans are going well, I will read any articles you create in the future as they are surely about interesting topics.TheGracefulSlick Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:25, 13 June 2015 (UTC)


Music, etc.

If you have any thoughts you are welcome to express them in this thread or in a new thread. Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:47, 31 July 2015 (UTC)

Just an overview of some future plans: I wanted to have a GA review for the Country Joe and the Fish article when things are not as busy. I was also going to focus a lot more on albums and songs, as of right now the Music Machine's debut album. I'm happy to report I created articles for the rest of the Seeds' studio album discography, which was one of my original main objectives. Sorry that I have been a little less involved lately, but remember I'm 17 and have all the priorities, pleasures, and pains that come with it. But if you need any help I'll still find some time to assist you to the best of my abilities.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:47, 2 August 2015 (UTC)
You have more than earned the right to take a break whenever you need to. This is hard work, and we don't want to burn ourselves out. As for me, I will probably have to cut back my Wiki-time too at least to some degree for a while. As you may know, I am a teacher, and I expect this to be an extra-busy year, as our state finally switches over to the Common Core for my grade level--so we will be reading some new novels and materials, etc. But, I don't want you to think that being a teacher puts me above anyone, because here at Wiki we are all equals as colleagues and editors (especially people like you who have dedicated themselves so much to excellence and have earned so much respect from all of us). Wiki is one place, thank heavens, where you don't have to be treated as a subordinate--this is like a professors' club, and you have earned the right to sit at any seat at the table. If you were never to write another word here, that would take nothing away, and I'd think nothing less, because you have contributed so much already--all of those wonderful things you have written about the rare and obscure musicians. But, I look forward to your future contributions. In the meantime, I know that you will enjoy some recreation-time away from the computer screen, so enjoy! Sometimes we all need to take a break for a while and re-charge our batteries (I even went on a two-year hiatus, but please don't make your Wiki-rest anywhere near that long)--I see it is your way of getting ready for the best things that are yet to come! Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:52, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
I created a small article on the Banshees (band). Just making you aware in case you wanted to add anything to it.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 21:06, 4 August 2015 (UTC)
Terrific. That's a much needed article on a much-deserving and trailblazing band. I could go get the liner notes from the CD and add any additional biographical information about the band that may be there. I put a blue link for them in the G.R. article and added them to the List of garage rock bands. While it crossed my mind, I was thinking that we could go check to make sure all of the garage and garage-psychedelic bands we know of have a blue link at the list there as well. Also, while I was at it, I added some of the great blues singers you did articles on to the List of blues musicians page. Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:11, 4 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks a lot. I actually wasn't aware of the list for blues musicians. I'll have to check that later to see if there is any articles I can improve. I'll try to make some of the articles you mentioned too. Right now, I'm filling some more of the gaps in the Pebbles series albums to complete the whole collection (hopefully).TheGracefulSlick (talk) 23:47, 4 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks! Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:49, 4 August 2015 (UTC)
Oh, by the way Ghmyrtle is on a "wiki-break" so we will unfortunately be without his services.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:34, 5 August 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, I dropped him a line anyway. I might go ahead and bring that edit back into the article, because I feel confident he will be "Kosher" with it now that we have a direct source. His only issue beforehand was that I only had indirect sources, but not a specific one as I now do. By establishing the sociological context it makes it possible for the article to get deeper and go into the "heart" of the music. I want to draw the reader in and get him or her caught up in the material, presenting it not just as a musical genre but a part of living history. I want walk the reader through the topography as if strolling through a big museum. This is the craziest thing, but I accidently found a direct source (the San Diego Study) addressing some of the philosophical concepts I had put into perspective in the psychedelic section--so I brought those "musings" back in. I want this article to capture the whole magic of this wonderful genre and its decade, the 60s--I believe the garage rock phenomenon is an essential aspect of the 60s experience and I want us to capture it a definitive way. Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:02, 5 August 2015 (UTC)

By the way, I wanted to try to improve the Count Five article. I tried my hand at it once before but was met with some disrespect by another user. Apparently, his reasoning was I was too new and I would just slander their name. Well that was two months ago so I feel it's safe to improve, not slander, the page. If I receive more unwarranted resistance I think I'll be a little more defensive than before because I have no intention of doing harm to the article.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 23:17, 5 August 2015 (UTC)

People with that kind of attitude are so ridiculous. I don't expect he'd cause trouble now, but if he continues to act disrespectfully, then the matter should be brought to the attention of administrators. Any editor's contributions should be welcome, provided that the contributions are factual and well sourced, and, of course, yours always are--you've always been dedicated to quality. I can't understand what his problem is. Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:30, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
I noticed you commented on my concern about the psychedelic rock article. I actually wrote about the Psychedelic Moods album so I'm fairly confident that the Deep's album was released a month before the Elevators and the Blues Magoos. Almost all of the references I used in that article described the point that it was the first to use "psychedelic" in the title. I think the Elevators sometimes are wrongly credited with that distinction because they are better known than the Deep, and since they are the first to promote themselves as "psychedelic". I'm not saying that the Elevators weren't groundbreaking in their own right, but I just believe that the facts should be correct, especially when we're writing about such an important musical genre.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 18:14, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
I was commenting on the Deep Psychedelic Moods album and agreed with your assessment about the date of release in relation to the Elevators' album. I wanted to throw in my name of support to help bolster the correction you wanted to make. Garagepunk66 (talk) 18:35, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
Yes, I realize and appreciate the support, I just was trying to discuss why there is some confusion over the topic. Also, I think the rewrite of "Your Gonna Miss Me" is coming along well, I hope it will be to your liking when it's complete. It's history is a lot more in-depth than I expected it and I'm happily suprised how much I can write about the song. Usually such a band is unfortunately overlooked, but in this instance there are plenty of sources to choose from.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 18:43, 8 August 2015 (UTC)

The "Your Gonna Miss Me" is going to be a vastly improved article! I was shocked to see what little had been written there before for such a great song. So, you have come to the rescue. I'm about to finish the international suite of sections for the G.R. article. I will probably finish the section on India this weekend. I made some changes to the British section that I think you'll like, to accommodate some of the concerns you mentioned, which I fully agree with. When I first did the British section I'll admit that I was really exhausted (I was doing something like 150-200 edits a day at that time--I was rushing to get major blocks of the article finished--I was afraid that the expansions would never get finished), so I had not really had a chance to properly proofread and evaluate a lot of what I had written. You'll notice that I have gone back and streamlined the language. So I think you'll like it a lot. Garagepunk66 (talk) 18:59, 8 August 2015 (UTC)

I know I don't always express it as much as I should but I do appreciate your expansions to the G.R. article. You don't always have to do those monster editing days, but I am impressed with how much you are able to sustain in one period. Since I haven't recommended anything in awhile, I was wondering if you heard of this Pittsburgh band called the Swamp Rats. They have this compilation album called Disco Still Sucks! that has almost all their material. There is some impressive punk renditions of songs like "Psycho" and "Louie, Louie".TheGracefulSlick (talk) 23:03, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
Thank you so much for your kind words--they mean a lot. Once I get the extensions on this crazy G.R. article out of the way, I'll be able to switch my focus to specific-topic articles, which I've been wanting to do more of. The G.R. thing kind of turned out to be a lot more difficult than I expected. At first I thought: "No problem, I'll just bang it out in a week or two." But, then once I got started I realized there was going to be a lot more involved--I was like: "Oh my God what mess have I gotten myself into here!"...and now at 390 references and counting, the darn crazy thing just never ends! I'm probably going have to cut back on Wiki-time though--I'm about to get uber-busy with my work responsibilities (and I know what you said about priorities which was so true)--but I'll try to keep up daily contributions, just on a smaller scale. So, I was putting a lot of pressure on myself to get the lion's share of the G.R. article out of the way before going back to work. I'll have to check out the Swamp Rats, who I guess are a current band. I liked that great article you did on the old Swamp Rats, but I'll have to check out the new Rats! They must be incredible! Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:54, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
It's actually the same Swamp Rats, but there actually is a "new" version of the band that still tours in Pittsburgh. My father saw them when the original lead vocalist Bob Hocko was a part of the band. To be honest, I rarely listen to anything beyond the 1970s. The only exceptions to that rule is music from the groups Queen, Sonic Youth, Nirvana, and Jefferson Starship. No offense to the musical acts that were successful then, but I think that's when rock music started to go downhill. Of course, I'm sure there are exceptions, which I see in some grudge rock groups, however, to me, (and I think you'll agree) the 1960s possessed the best music we will experience.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:57, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
Gosh what you say is so right! I definitely prefer the older stuff too. Wow, the Swamp Rats are still together! Your dad really knows a lot of great musicians too. My brother is a big fan of Sonic Youth. I haven't followed them as much as he has, but I really like their Sister and Daydream Nation albums. I really love the Clash. I got to meet Paul Simenon a few years back I went to see him at a club when he was playing with Damon Albarn and Tony Allan in The Good the Bad and the Queen, who only made one album, but how I love it. After the show one of the rodies told me and my friends to wait about a half hour until everyone was gone and the band members would come out and chat with us. We waited, and we got to have a small audience with the band over a few pints of beer. It is something I will never forget. They were the kindest people. I had a good chat with Damon Albarn, then Tony Allan, who had played with Fela Kuti in the 70s, and then had a chat with Paul Simenon, who was the kindest and most humble person. If I hadn't gotten to talk to them it still would have been a great night, because the band was so fantastic. It was a night I'll never forget. Another wonderful night was the Ponderosa Stomp (festival) in 2013. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:16, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
Oh also: I love that song "Get Away Girl" by the Fantastic Dee Jays. Man, to think that you dad knew the lead singer! Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:30, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
Yeah his old job opened a lot of opportunities to meet some accomplished musicians. He has kept in contact with some of them and I've been able to talk with them. Though he has seen so many more musicians than me, I did have the honor of meeting Tom Hamilton of the Human Expression, Burton Stahl of the Music Explosion, and of course I've told you about Bob Markley. It is amazing how much they remember from their heyday, they have so many stories even though, unfortunately, their band's didn't survive for very long. By the way, Sonic Youth's Bad Moon Rising is worth a listen as well.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:35, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
Those are all incredible people. And I know you'll especially cherish the picture you have that was taken with Bob Markley all those years ago. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:40, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

Good news! I just completed the international sections--I can't believe it! I am so relieved--it is as if a humungous burden has finally been lifted from my back. Of course, I still do have to do the Psychedelic and Folk sections (and then of course whatever piecemeal additions to the regions, counties, etc.), but at last I can see a light at the end of the tunnel, and I feel as if the lions share is now out of the way. I can finally breathe again. Give it a read. I know you'll really like it a lot. I think you'll really dig the sections about India and the far east. I want to eventually add some stuff about Saigon and Cambodia, but finding sources right now is really a hard find. I saw a really cool movie about 60s rock in Cambodia called Don't Think I've Forgotten: Cambodia's Lost Rock and Roll. Incredible movie! Go to Youtube and check out some songs by Yom Aurlarong. He was incredible. He ended up getting liquidated by the Khmer Rouge in their mass genocide. They killed a lot of musicians and artists. He was a real hero. Garagepunk66 (talk) 04:29, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

I was completely unaware of any garage rock bands in India. It's really nice to see your whole project coming together. I checked over the article itself and added some wikilinks, but that was about it revision-wise. I also am happy to say I expanded the "You're Gonna Miss Me" article. I'll add some other info later. I want to go back to improving and creating articles related to the G.R. article so I'm going to edit the Brogues and the Dovers sometime soon. If there are any other bands that need an article, I'll see if it's possible. Unfortunately, I doubt there would be any references for any of those Indian groups, though I've listened to some and dig their music.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 18:36, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

Thanks so much for putting the links into the article! I just finished reading a great book about Indian garage/psych called India Psychedelic, by Sidharth Bhatia. It is on the racks at Barnes & Noble as we speak. I had been aware of the Simla Beat 70 71 compilation, but I was awestruck to see this book sitting on the rack at Barnes & Noble. I thought I must be out of my mind. So, I bought it on the spot! Great read. I know you'd enjoy it. Garagepunk66 (talk) 19:54, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

I just finished the article about the Gaunga Dyns (it's great how for the first time in over a month and a half, I can finally think about other articles again), but I'm going to leave it in Sandbox #5 until I can get Ghmyrtle to give it his high-level approval, because since I know members of the band, I don't want there to be any perceived conflict of interest--I want him to be able to look it over to verify that I have only gone by reliable external sources and that the tone article is objective (for instance all of the quotes are taken form articles). I worked extra hard not to let my inside knowledge affect the article. The only line not sourced is the last one about more recent performances--I'll try to find a source, but it's not private information (yet essential)--it's already out the in the public sphere, so I included it. But, I'd love for you to look at the article too (and I'm sure you'd give it your seal of approval as well). I think you'll like it a lot. Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:03, 10 August 2015 (UTC)

It's actually a really lengthy and detailed article, especially considering they only produced two singles. I didn't see anything that would bring up concerns of conflict of interest so I think you can create the page anytime you want. I've noticed a trend that you know bands that were involved in the Ponderstomp Festival. I was going to create an article on this group called the Bad Roads. Since I can tell you are knowledgeable with Louisiana bands, I assume you know this band too. It's nice to see you're working on band articles again, it will give us more opportunities to chat. Hopefully in a day I'll have the Brogues page expanded, "(I Ain't No) Miracle Worker" page created, and then move on to more projects that will link to the G.R. article.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 04:18, 10 August 2015 (UTC)

Well, I only have attended the 2013 festival, which had a lot of garage acts. The one this year will probably not have as much garage, but I want to go anyway, so that I can see many of the greats from other genres. I think the Bad Roads played at the Stomp a few years back. Garagepunk66 (talk) 16:29, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
You are correct, they did attend and I think the Bad Roads will be featured at more in the future. It's interesting, I never realized that Louisiana had such an impressive garage rock scene. So far I've listened to class acts like Dr. Spec's Optical Illusion, the Bad Roads, and the Bees. I wanted to write about the Bees, but I remember you saying you also wanted to, and I know you'll represent the band accordingly, so it's fine with me.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 18:31, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
So many states were blessed to have a lot of great bands. And, certainly, Pennsylvania was no slouch. That song "From My Window" by the Shaynes is a classic. I think they were from Lancaster, which is a town you would probably consider to be "real Pennsylvania," (unlike Philedelphia--oops I better not have said that word!). Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:26, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
Well Philidelphia did produce chart-topping acts like the Soul Survivors, Jay and the Techniques, and the Intruders. It was also the place that the Deep recorded their groudbreaking album and was the home of the Electric Factory, a popular venue for psychedelic artists. While I enjoy the work of many 1960s Lancaster and Allentown groups that are actually remembered more than I first anticipated, Philadelphia undeniably did have some memorable artists.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 23:44, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
On the basis of those great bands, Philadelphia has been "redeemed." Actually, think Philly is an incredible place and have been there and loved it. Usually the biggest city in a state gets the ire of residents who live in other towns. It seems to be universal thing. I'm sure that people in Shreveport consider New Orleans to be a different country (as probably most people in the United States do). There were a bunch of great bands in Shreveport, just as in New Orleans, Baton Rouge, and Lafayette (and oh yes, Lake Charles, home of the Bad Roads!). I know Paula Records was centered in Shreveport, and they recorded a lot of acts. So I'll give Shreveport some well-deserved credit. Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:29, 11 August 2015 (UTC)

Sorry if my response seemed a little as a matter-of-fact or something along that line. I just didn't want you to get the impression Philadelphia didn't produce some fine rock groups before they developed funk and later hip-hop (which I'm not into at all). There actually was this local group called the Crunch that is fondly remembered in my hometown. It included my great-uncle, and it was he who got me interested in the wonder of garage rock. Of course, they aren't known well outside my town, but I thought it was cool they produced a single before disbanding. It contained covers of the Rolling Stones' "Lady Jane" and "Play With Fire". Just goes to show any teenager with a dream to be in a band back then could have their moment of fame.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:05, 11 August 2015 (UTC)

Didn't seem matter of fact at all--I enjoyed leaning about Jay and the Techniques, who I wasn't aware of--I'll definitely check them out! And I dig some of the great Philly soul and funk of the early to mid 70s. Philly is a great music town. I guess there was still some music happening in the early 70s, particularly reggae and soul, but I guess as you were saying, somewhere after that music started becoming more plastic and commercial. I dig some of the 70s punk and new wave, but as a shole I'm more of a 60s person. Garagepunk66 (talk) 19:32, 11 August 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, Jay and the Techniques will probably always be remembered for "Apples, Peaches, and Pumpkin Pie", but there is more to them than that. The city was amazing for all of its soul groups which I enjoy. I've tried to get into funk but the only band I like from that genre is Sly and the Family Stone. By the way, I just bought this compilation album called Louisiana Punk Groups from the Sixties, Vol. 1, with Vol. 2 on the way, and I'm totally hooked on the recordings. It has a lot of the groups we worked on already like the Gaunga Dyns, Dr. Spec's Optical Illusion, and the Bad Roads, among others.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 20:20, 11 August 2015 (UTC)

For some awesome funk, check out the Meters. I particularly love their early stuff when they did instrumentals (kind of "garage funk"). Check out "Cissy Strut" from 1968. They had been the house band for a lot of the Allen Toussaint-produced records of the mid 60s (many recorded at Cosimo Matassa's famous studios). They play Lee Dorsey's "Workin' on a Coal Mine," "Ride Your Pony," and a bunch of other early New Orleans funk/R&B tracks circa 1965-1969. Oh yes, and I love the sweet vintage reggae from the late 60s and early 70s: Toots & the Maytals, who did "Pressure Drop", Desmond Decker, who cut "Israelires," Jimmy Ciff, the Slickers "Johnny too Bad," etc. And of course Bob Marley & the Wailers, particularly when they had Peter Tosh & Bunny Wailer in the group. Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:35, 11 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm actually really impressed with the Meters, I wish I heard about them sooner. By the way, I was reading 1,001 Songs You Must Hear Before You Die and I found this song by the Preachers. It's a cover version of Bo Diddley's "Who Do You Love". They recorded that in 1965 and they must have been one of the most gritty bands of that year. I'm definitely going to make my next article about them.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:06, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

I can't believe they don't yet have an article, because they have been comp'd on Pebbles and places--so you will come to the rescue. They were really crazy. They'd wear priest outfits. I love their version of Diddley's song. By the way there is a great performance by Bo Diddley on The Real TNT Show from 1966. It was similar to the TAMI show in '64. Also on the bill were the Byrds, Phil Spector, Joan Baez singing both folk...and rock!!!), Donovan, the Lovin' Spoonful and many more--incredible--I don't know if it is available on official release, but I got to see it on an "unofficial release" and I think it is on Youtube. Diddley rocks the house down! I've been busy the last couple of days, so I haven't gotten to do much editing. We are setting up our rooms and doing the seminars, so I've been real busy. I work in a field where people can be terrific contributors to Wiki, but short on time. This year I expect to get really busy with work, but I'll try to keep making regular daily contributions the best way I can, provided of course I can most importantly do high quality lesson planning and grading (I always have to put my job responsibilities and the needs of my students first--that is always priority 1). By the way, I teach eleventh grade Eng. III and A.P. Language & Comp. I really love the unit on Romanticism best, because I can take the students way-deep into the thematic terrain--I like it because it is really all about being a "seer" and being able to conceptualize human existence on another level (and of course the 60s was a neo-Romantic era). I suppose I'm both a realist and a Romantic. And, then of course with my A.P. group I go extra-deep into all of that terrain plus the stuff involving rhetorical analysis--last year we even read Plato and Socrates. We first did Crito and then Gorgias. I taught them about the different kinds of reasoning (i.e. logical, empirical, etc.) and all of the different kinds of arguments and how to make and analyze them. I hate standardized tests, because I believe in teaching to something much higher--to human aspirations. Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:54, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

I'm equally suprised, especially since their material is more accessible than other garage acts. I found they had an EP called Moanin', which was released by Sundazed. That means my father should have it stored somewhere and they usually have great liner notes. I thought it was interesting the band's label actually fined Richard Fortunato for how he sang "Who Do You Love". Apparently it was too rocking for them if that is possible. And it's funny you mention those classes since I just was enrolled in them last school year. I feel your pain with standardized testing, even though I do quite well I still believe there is a human aspect were losing as a result.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 05:55, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

You're preachin' to the choir (and mentioning the Preachers in one fell swoop). Amen! Richard Fortunato rocked! Hey, I've now entered the international sections into the G.R. article. You'll notice I re-worked the British section in a way I think you'll like (you'll notice for freakbeat I put the term "more stylish British correlative" [to garage] as a way of differentiating, yet still addressing the vital connection). By the way, I enjoyed reading the 13th Floor Elevators "You're Gonna Miss Me" article. You have definitely elevated it up a whole bunch of floors--it's on its way to becoming a skyscraper! Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:26, 13 August 2015 (UTC)

I just created the Preachers article. I'm glad you furthered the British section to explain they were considered their own specific genre. I know there isn't a huge difference for a casual listener of 1960s music, but it was still wise to mention the difference. As for the "You're Gonna Miss Me" article I'm happy I was the one to rescue it from the sorry state it was in. Such an important song deserves more than four random sentences, no offense to whoever created it. That's why we are here though, to create articles that reflect on the importance of the topic and to save ones that need a little (or a lot!) more work.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 05:15, 13 August 2015 (UTC)
Yeah, I was aware of the British distinction and was actually more in that mindset at first, but then I noticed that some of the sources had things like "freakbeat, beat, garage" to describe British bands, and I guess I was getting tired from all the editing. I acknowledge the distinction and realize the need to state it directly, but also recognize certain overlapping boundaries. It's a fine line--a balancing act. I hope I have found the perfect place to draw that line, but also to show the essential connections and parallels. I hope I've gotten it just right. Garagepunk66 (talk) 13:37, 14 August 2015 (UTC)
After a few more articles on some garage and psychedelic artists I've been meaning to do, I plan to finally rewrite the Grace Slick article. If you look at it as is, the article is really shabby and even disrespectful in some sections. Also I haven't had any takers on reviewing the Country Joe and the Fish article for GA. I'm only telling you this now because I wanted to give other users an equal chance to review. If you wanted to try another review I'd be happy to entrust you with the task.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 22:37, 14 August 2015 (UTC)
That article about Grace Slick re-written by TheGracefulSlick--that will be quite a match! I've been so busy with work this week that I haven't had much time to do much Wiki. However, I will try to finish two articles about the Gentlemen from Dallas--one about the band and the other about their song "It's a Cry'n' Shame" tomorrow or Sunday. One of my favorite songs of all time. Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:42, 15 August 2015 (UTC)
I love the Gentlemen, I assumed that such a great band had an article already. Great find! Texas had such amazing garage rock bands like the Zakaru Thaks, the Bad Seeds, Kenny and the Kasuals, among many others. It's a shame they don't get as much notice as bands from California and Michigan.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:00, 15 August 2015 (UTC)
Yeah, I was kind of surprised myself. When I was doing a search for the article, I noticed there was not one there, so I got to work on it. I might as well do one on the song, "It's a Cry'n Shame," as well, because it is such a great song. Garagepunk66 (talk) 18:01, 15 August 2015 (UTC)
I just finished the band article on the Gentlemen, and I'll finish the article on their song, "It's a Cry'n Shame" tomorrow. Check it out. I'm sure you'll like it a lot. I want to do and article on the Chessmen. I think that Jimmy Vaughn, Stevie Ray Vaughn's brother, also played in that band for a brief spell. I'd like to do one on the Briks. I'm so happy to be able to be free to do band articles again! Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:25, 16 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks again for the article, it is a good read. Just a word of advice, be extra careful when writing about a song. I particularly enjoy writing about songs and wish I did it more, but creating a song article, especially for one that didn't chart, is three times more difficult than writing a non-charting album or band article. Honestly, the only non-charting song articles I created were "I Ain't No Miracle Worker" and "The White Ship", but they passed notability on other credentials. While I agree "It's a Cry'n Shame" is among the best garage rock songs I've heard, others may not agree. If problems arise I'll be ready to give the article needed support. Since you mentioned bands I thought it would be perfect to recommend a version of "I Had Too Much to Dream Last Night" by Rasputin and the Mad Monks. It's the fifth different rendition of the song I've found and it takes trippy to a new level!TheGracefulSlick (talk) 05:43, 16 August 2015 (UTC)
Pay no attention to what is the sandbox now--right now the song article is in a strictly tentative state. I cut and pasted the info. from the band article--just to use it as a starting point and have the background info.--I didn't have a chance to work on it last night, because I hooked up with my friend from the Gaunga Dyns (he really likes the article on his band) and we went to see Pat McLaughlin play at a club (great show!!!), but today I will go in and work on it. I plan to completely overhaul it. I also want to address the lyrics and thematic content of the song. Luckily we have several sources that testify to the high stature of the song. I bought a book by Mike Markesich, which has a list of singles by over 16,000 bands, but it also gives ratings and rankings of songs voted on by a panel of noted writers and experts (i.e. Alec Paolo, etc.). The book was outrageously expensive (it cost almost as much as a Rolls Royce!), but I bought it for the purpose of allowing me to do articles about little-known bands who sang great songs--but henceforth inoculating the articles against deletionsitsts and other Wiki marauders. It will be helpful to have a book source cited in these situations (i.e. when groups do not have a chart position or an AllMusic write-up), so my plan is to use the book to help make articles possible that would otherwise get thrown into the abyss. By the way, if you write an article about a band that does not have a chart position or an AllMusic write-up, just let me know and I'll cite references from the book, particularly if the band had a song that is highly regarded, because I can show the ratings and rankings. Garagepunk66 (talk) 15:26, 16 August 2015 (UTC)

Our expertise is almost completely in bands that never charted. The only band articles I created in which the group actually charted were Larry's Rebels and Eternity's Children. Though if you had anything on the Banshees, that would be helpful. It's a short article so there is always room for expansion. Their song "Project Blue" has always been one of my favorites. If I somehow find an original 45 (very doubtful, but still) it would be the prize of my collection.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 18:02, 16 August 2015 (UTC)

I'd be delighted to do that. I could put Markesich's book source in and, oh yes, that info. from the liner notes to the Oh Yeah CD, which I've been meaning to do--I sorry that I got so tied up. I' be happy to put those extra sources in there as a way of keeping deletionists away. Garagepunk66 (talk) 21:15, 16 August 2015 (UTC)
P.S.: I was thinkin' we could check to make sure that Larry's Rebels are mentioned in the List of garage rock bands page. Maybe we could do a search to get as many garage and garage-psych bands in there as we can (bands that have articles)--that way we can give people a way to gravitate towards learning more about these wonderful bands and of course reading these fantastic articles! Oh also, thank you for correcting my "typo" in the Gentlemen article. I've was in a rush to catch the Pat McLaughlin show, so I didn't get chance to proofread it as thoroughly as I should have. Also, I just added some further info. to the Gentlemen article, which I think enriches it. I wanted to add something about their later developments and Seab Meador's untimely death. He was such a great musician. It is sad that he died too young and all but forgotten. I hope that this article will do justice to his memory. Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:15, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

That would be a big help, you can get around to it anytime you want, so don't feel obligated. As for the listing I'll see if there are any we are missing, but I doubt we missed very much. I'll be adding the Bad Seeds to the list shortly after I finish creating it. There actually were two Bad Seeds that were active around the same time and relatively the same place. That nearly tripped me up which would have been quite a blunder. Both groups, I've found, are worth listening to, but the one from Corpus Christi is my favorite.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:07, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

I can't believe that the Corpus Christi band doesn't have an article...I know Joe Strummer of the Clash mentioned them in a bio of him I have on DVD. It's a good thing that we're gettin' some stuff on these Texas bands! I can't wait to see your article. Hey, I just finished the "It's a Cry'n Shame" article. I might put in some derails with the lyrics in later, but I wanted to get the article posted, but I'll get to that later. Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:15, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
Just another note when creating future song articles, make sure the background is essential to the song. You sometimes gave general notes about the band's history such as how they formed and where they performed. Such a history should be reserved for the Gentlemen article. Information you may need is how/where the song was composed, description of the arrangements and lyrics if possible, and anything notable about recent personnel shifts. Other than that, I was particularly impressed with the reception section and how it was written. Since it was your first song article, it definitely is a lot better than most so, like anything else, it just takes repitition.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 15:01, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for your kind advice. I'll be sure to make the necessary changes later today. And of course, I'll keep it in mind on future song articles.Garagepunk66 (talk) 17:00, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

In the "Cry'in Shame" song article I have added some bits about the lyrical content (and band performance), based on characterizations from former drummer Tim Justice. I would like to print experts from the lyrics, but I want to check on the latest publishing info. first. The original publisher was Vandanburg (i guess having to do with the Vandan label), liscensed through BMI, according to the record label, but chances are that the rights have changed hands. I have a copy of the Fort Worth Teen Scene Vol. 3 CD, which is the latest to comp. the song--by the way, it is by far the best-sounding I've heard--they mastered it from a recently found acetate taken from the 1966 sessions (not the '65 acetate of the demo version and not the 1966 Vanden 45--most of which are understandably worn out--supposedly the mastering for the Vandan 45 was never properly done). My guess is that the '66 acetate sounds almost exactly the way the song would have been heard after the final mix (but before the mastering). It literally blasts out of the speakers! So anyway, I'll check to see if there is more recent publishing info there. Garage comps tend to be very vague about these kinds of details. Garagepunk66 (talk) 16:31, 18 August 2015 (UTC)
I first heard the song on Back from the Grave, Volume 9. It's definitely the highlight to any compilation. Right now I'm going a little off topic to Brit folk as I'm rewriting the album Just Another Diamond Day by Vashti Bunyan. I'm in love with folk musicians/groups from England including the Incredible String Band, Steeleye Span, and Fairport Convention. But I also have a small side project to complete album articles for the sub-series, Planetary Pebbles. It features artists from around the world, even bands east of the Iron Curtain. They are among the rarest recordings I've listened to and are actually respectable for groups that hardly had any chance to record. If you're interested, the first album is called Surfbeat Behind the Iron Curtain, Vol. 1. TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:04, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

The version on BFTG Vol. 9 is the 1965 demo acetate, which is really incredible. However, if you haven't by now (but which you probably have), check out the "official" version recorded in 1966--the best-sounding master of that 66 version appears on Fort Worth Teen Scene Vol. 3. If you go to Youtube (not Google), it will be at top of the queue posted by "The Psychedelic Garage." [[1]] Although it is not quite as punky as the 65 demo, it has an "eternal" quality that is to be heard in very few records--the heartbreak expressed in that version is just overwhelming, and yet it ends up being a celebration of life all-the-while--a great punk song about love. It summons up everything that is so magical about 60s garage. I'm glad you mentioned the iron curtain. I'd like to add some stuff about iron curtain bands in the international section of the G.R. article down the road. You'll notice that I'm starting on those Teenage Shutdown albums I promised I'd do. I setting up a lead-out article, and then I might start with Vol. 10, the most famous. This will be the first time I've tried to upload album images, something for which I've never had the need to do up until now. I guess that before I attempt to upload an image, I first must find the name of the file (i.e. "greatest_album_in_the_world.jpg.," or whatever you call it)--however Google images doesn't provide the name of the image anymore (it used to), so I'll have to try somewhere else, unless there is something there I don't see there. Perhaps you could recommend a place to find the name for album image file names (which are not yet uploaded to Wiki), then I could try to upload some. Do you have any advice? Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:00, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

If you are referring to the file image uploader's request for an image name at the beginning of the process, then the image title is of your choosing. It just needs to be an accurate description of the image. So, for all practical purposes, the album title is suitable. I too will get back into the project by creating some album articles. I will observe how you write volume 10 so there is consistency to the format of the series. I'm also glad you want to mention iron curtain bands as it is a part of garage rock few people are aware of. I would write articles about some of the bands, but unfortunately so little is known about their histories.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 03:16, 19 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks so much for your kind advice. What I'll do is create the initial "plain" version of the articles based on the albums I have(without the additional liner notes info., which can get added later), so at first we'll have a universal template for the articles in their basic form. I'll try to download the images, but If I run into. jam, I'll let you know. And, then of course later we can add the liner notes info. about the bands and songs as described in the LP's and CD's liner notes. Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:11, 20 August 2015 (UTC)
Ok, I don't expect the articles to be lengthy, but I know you agree it's important to feature this series. It was smart of you to make a series article before the albums, so now the articles can easily be found in one place. I need to make a similar article for the Planetary Pebbles series, since I don't think the main Pebbles article suits it well for discography purposes. If you wanted to get in on that, let me know because there are two more album articles needed to complete its discography.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:28, 20 August 2015 (UTC)

I'm trying to upload an image of the logo that appears on all of the albums, but it isn't getting anywhere. I copied the image from a picture of the logo I found on the internet onto my computer. On my PC, it would not save onto "Pictures," so I put it in "Word" document. Then I went to the Wizard and gave it a name ("Teenage Shutdown series.jpg."). I did all of the check-offs and carefully explained the terms of its use, but the "upload" button remained frozen, so it wont upload at this time. Is it that the logo image just won't do. Is the Wizard the wrong place to upload an image? What am I doing wrong? I'll try again tomorrow. But, I am so busy with work right now--my Wiki time is limited right now. Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:45, 20 August 2015 (UTC)

If you have difficulties, I'll upload it if you want. Just tell me what to search for and I'll give it the same file name you wanted. I'm not really good with computers, the only reasons I use one is for wiki and homework, so I don't really know what the problem could be.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 03:54, 20 August 2015 (UTC)
I might try it on my Google Chrome browser, or maybe I could download Mozilla Firefox--perhaps it doesn't jive with Explorer. It may be that that particular image. Or, it may be an issue with my computer. If none of those remedies work, I'll let you know, and then you can download it. Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:03, 20 August 2015 (UTC)
Got the Teenage Shudown! logo uploaded!!! However, I was accidently logged out when I added it...oops. But hey, the picture is there now, so the article now looks real nice. Check out the Savages' Live ‘n Wild album. It now has a huge picture of the front cover in the info box! Yeah, when I want over to Google Chrome, everything worked just right. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:17, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

I just noticed that the "List of garage rock and psychedelic compilations" article was deleted. [[2]] I saw the template in the Teenage Shutdown! (series) saying it is "orphaned." So, I went to find the "List of garage rock and psychedelic compilations" article (to insert its mention) and noticed that it was gone. I know that Ghmyrtle is on Wikibreak, but I left him a message anyway. It is so unfortunate that senseless deletionists do things like this--it really hampers our efforts in an unconstructive way. But, maybe we could try to reconstitute the article form mirrors on other sites, but change the wording and get better sourcing. We definitely need a list article for the comps. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:54, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

P.S.: I have a re-constituted version of the list in my Sandbox #10. I know, maybe I'm being a renegade to do this, but my opinion is that the editors and administrators who are responsible for the deletion committed a well-intentioned act of vandalism, and that we have a duty to re-instate the article. Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:31, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

I agree but it will probably be a tough sell to everyone else. If you are concerned the Teenage Shutdown series is an orphan, remember it won't be as soon as it's albums are made into articles.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:49, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

True, and those other volume articles are on the way. Nonetheless, we'll still need a list-article to serve as a vital hub, so that people can have the fullest access to these articles. However, if we want to make the case for inclusion, then we'll have to improve the list (i.e. have more blue-linked articles or at least include citations for whatever entries are red-lettered, which admittedly was not done before). I think it can be accomplished. Let's face it--we were sleeping (I take a lot of the blame) when the deletionists snatched the eggs out of our nest last time, but this time we'll be more vigilant. Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:59, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

I agree, but if I remember when I read the reasons why it was deleted, one point was psychedelic rock and garage rock had no reason to be mixed together. To my understanding, the person who created it was User:Shockingblue, the same user who made the Pebbles, High in the Mid-Sixties, and Essential Pebbles Series. While I commend his hard work, sometimes he forgets to reference the articles or structure them properly, which explains why some of his articles were targeted.

It is unfortunate that some of the editors who made that argument were unaware that there was a whole psychedelic garage element which is well-documented. I hope that the psychedelic garage section I am preparing for the G.R. article could help relieve some of their misunderstandings. This could be more clearly explained in the list-article--and also it could make more clear that the psychedelic bands included on the list would be the garage-psychedelic bands. Or, perhaps we could just simply title the new article "Garage rock compilations" and include the psychedelic garage bands in it (then not have to explain a thing). I don't think that the skeptics would have a problem if we present it in that context. Garagepunk66 (talk) 04:25, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
I don't know, I mean the genres are completely different. I'll need to look back at the discussion to see if there are other solutions. We could make two seperate articles for each genre, but the problem is many compilations compile both garage and psychedelic artists.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 04:28, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
Ok here were the issues: Too many red links, no sources, and a confusion as to why the genres were placed together. Does that help?TheGracefulSlick (talk) 04:36, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

We could just call the article "List of garage rock compilations," but include the psychedelic-garage bands on it. Obviously, there are types of psychedelic that would not fit. Obviously, the elaborate baroque style of psychedelic popular with big name bands in England circa 1967 (i.e. Sgt. Pepper, Satanic Magesty's, etc.) is a totally separate entity and outside of garage. The sophisticated style of jam-based acid rock which showcased instrumental virtuosity (i.e. Hendrix, etc.) is also in a totally separate category. But, then there are the psychedelic-garage comps., (i.e. including tracks by bands such as the Electric Prunes, the 13th Floor Elevators, the Deep, the Blues Magoos and lesser-knowns of their ilk, --stuff sometimes referred to as "punkadelic"), which would be essential for inclusion on the list. For red links (or better-yet black letters) we could put a citation next to each one (that is considered OK). And then have more blue links.Garagepunk66 (talk) 05:05, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

That could work. As the discussion on the deletion said, the content was notable, but the format killed the article. I don't think that should qualify for a deletion if all it needed was a name change and better organization, but I don't think the voters cared much for the topic. I wanted to create some compilation album articles (other than the Teenage Shutdown articles I will contribute) so the list will be lengthy when it gets running again. I'd also advise the original creator User:Shocking Blue, if I were you, I think he will be pleased with your effort. TheGracefulSlick (talk) 05:54, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
Terrific! And even on the comps mentioned that don't have articles, we could put a citation or two next to each one (and perhaps use black letters rather than red on those titles--that would make them seem less vulnerable). The funny thing is that, with the name change to "List of garage rock compilations," those unsympathetic editors you referred to probably won't even care enough to notice that the article has been resurrected. I am confident that Wiki can have a garage comp article again--this time a better and more bulletproof one, which can enjoy a safe and permanent existence here at Wikipedia. Garagepunk66 (talk) 18:07, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
I did articles on volumes 4 and 10 of Teenage Shutdown. I hope you like the format and setup for the articles--it is clean and simple. If there is anything that you think should be different in the format, let me know. You'll notice that for Vol. 4, I was not able to find the track time-lengths, but I'll try to get that in later--I guess that we can include track lengths in the song listings if it they're available. I have tried to get the wording of the titles exactly the way they is presented on the records (obviously adapting it to standard norms of capitalization/non-capitalization to be used in continuous text). Some of the later volumes of the series put the title in quotation marks. You can see the title names (for setup) in the list at the bottom of the series article. Of course, you can double check to make sure I got them right. I don't know exactly which label to say the series appears on. The first four or five volumes have the "Crypt Records" logo on the back sleeve, but the ones after that doe not mention a label. Discogs and Amazon say "Teenage Shutdown" as the label, but I don't put much stock in that--there is no label by that name that I know of. Obviously Tim Warren (of Crypt Records) is involved in the whole thing. All of the volumes (at least CD's), both early and late, are manufactured in Germany (i.e. Hamburg). So are Crypt records' albums such as BFTG. I think it is safe to assume that Crypt Records is the company involved, but I don't quite come out and say that. But, I did mention that "Tim Warren of Crypt records" was behind the thing, which is true. Here are the volumes I own (not including the two I just finished articles on), so I could do these:
  • Vol. 3 Things Been Bad
  • Vol. 5 Nobody to Love
  • Vol. 6 I'm Down Today
  • Vol. 9 Teen Jangler Blowout
  • Vol. 13 I'm Gonna Stay
If you'd like, I could also do another one or two, maybe Vol. 11 and another if you wish. So, if you'd like, you could do the rest-unless you want to swap any, which is OK with me. Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:48, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
Sorry for my absence, I'm extremely happy with the progress so far. I'd gladly write the volumes not listed starting today. I'll look over what you did so far to see what kind of info you want in the articles.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:34, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
No problem--I hope you enjoyed your well-earned day off. I noticed that Discogs provides the songwriters' credits for their list songs on Vol. 3, so I'll put that on the track listings for that particular comp. However, don't feel you need to worry about that (unless you can find a source that lists the songwriters)--it really won't be necessary to list songwriters on most comps right at this early time. I can always go back later and get the songwriter info from the liner notes to the sets I own--but no rush now. Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:45, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
P.S.: I noticed that Paradise of Garage Comps often puts the city and state for the bands on its track listings, which made it really easy for me. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:08, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
I just wish I gave you a heads up, especially since you were starting the album discography. I'll have the first one up today and we will go from there. By the way, I had this question that has started large debates with my friends, so let's see what you think. The question is, if you could choose any 60s band to make an album in their prime that never had the opportunity, which would it be? Personally, for me it was the Third Bardo, but obviously there are many other choices.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:01, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
Oh gosh, that's a tough one, because so many of them never had a chance to put out a long-player. I'd probably have to list about a three thousand bands! I'm glad your friends care enough about this topic to argue about it--that goes to show that there is hope for mankind yet! I hope you've gotten them into good music. Several of the bands could be hmmmmm... definitely the Third Bardo!... the Gentlemen, Evil, the Grodes... First Crow to the Moon (although Blondie turned out to be Jeff Stein's wish-fulfillment). We the People never actually cut an album, though they now have been anthologized by Sundazed--thank God. I could go on all night. There are probably a bunch of bands I feel just as enthusiastic about, that I forgot to mention. They were all so wonderful. Hey, you'll notice there were a bunch of bands from the Penn State on the comp I'm doing the article on right now (Shutdown Vol. 6)--I made sure to point that out. By the way, it is one of my very favorite garage comps--it gets really deep into some somber and reflective territory--a lot of the bands really dig deep into the inner depths of American folkloric idioms--I've always felt that the 60s garage bands were perhaps (in their way) some of the last true practitioners of old-time taproot American music--almost as if somehow they were mythically connected to the spirit of the Smithsonian Folkways artists. You will love Teenage Shutdown Vol. 6! Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:30, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
Yes, it was quite a debate. Among the bands chosen were the Birds (not the Byrds, who I love), the Del-Vetts, and, the Zakary Thaks. I just think the Third Bardo deserved an LP since "I'm Five Years Ahead of My Time" and "My Rainbow Life" are all-time classics to me. But then again there were dozens of groups who also should have made an album. As for the album series, I should have vol 1 complete by today. It just takes a little longer since I need to write from my iPhone, which is extremely tedious for track listings. I'll need to listen to vol 6. One of my friends almost has the complete series so I'm sure the sixth is among them. By the way, if it's ok with you, could we archive this section soon? I think it's almost double what it was when you archived it the first time!TheGracefulSlick (talk) 04:46, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

Oh yes, I was meaning to archive the thread. So, I'll start a new thread below. If you would like to go ahead and do the Vol. 1 article, I can go in and add in the track listing afterard (due to the iPhone situation, which is definitley not ideal--I hope you are able to gain use of a better computer soon). Garagepunk66 (talk) 17:00, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

Song I like by Wayne Fontana & the Mindbenders

I love the song called "The Game of Love" by Wayne Fontana & the Mindbenders because that song is really a great song. BaseballFan&MusicLover (talk) 22:09, 15 August 2015 (UTC)

Great song. I love it too!!! Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:29, 15 August 2015 (UTC)

Shutdown series, etc.

Here is the much-needed new thread. Garagepunk66 (talk) 17:01, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

Thanks, though I'm sure we will have this section filled up in no time! I'll have the second volume complete today, and then we can discuss more about who does what is left over. I want to try to help as much as I can so I can do whatever you need for the remainder of the project.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:42, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for the terrific article on Volume 1. I guess I could do articles on the ones I own and you could do the others (about half/half). By the way, I was reflecting on what you were saying about those discussions with your friends, and I just think it is positively fantastic all of you are having arguments about the Birds vs. the Byrds, etc., etc. These are exactly the kinds of arguments that should be encouraged, and it makes me think that maybe there is hope for the world at long last. I'm imagining that you have turned all of your friends onto 60s music, and that the fever is now rapidly spreading. Now, the only thing left to do is start bands. Let the revolution begin! Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:54, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
We like playing music but I don't think any of them want to form a band (though I've tried!). One of them is really interested in this movement called the "Bosstown Sound", which produced several psychedelic bands to try and compete with San Francisco. Personally, I think some great bands like Ultimate Spinach, Beacon Street Union, and Listening came out of the scene, but it got a bad rap. I'm supposed to make an article upon my friend's insistence. The most interesting thing I've found is that my friends have their own individual interests in 60s music. For me it's more toward psychedelia and folk, but for them it spans from the early hard rock (Blue Cheer, The Stooges, Ancient Grease) bands to avant-garde artists (Fifty Foot Hose, Frank Zappa, United States of America).TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:10, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
And all of that music is so wonderful--I love all of those great artists. I was guessing that you probably played music, mainly based on the fact that you love listening to it so much (how could it be any other way), but also that your father has been involved with recording studios and has known so many wonderful people. My dad loved traditional jazz. He was a real aficionado and could tell you practically anything about the great records and performers on those great records--he particularly dug King Oliver's band when Louis Armstrong was in it (before going solo). He would have made a great Wikipedian. He loved so many kinds of music. In a year or two I'd like to do some stuff on traditional jazz, and delta blues too. As it turns out I play guitar and drums. I have a Mexican Strat that actually sounds really good (its got that "sparkle & clang" I look for). I have a '71 Fender Champ to practice on and man, that little thing cranks. I have a set of "71 green sparkle Ludwigs sitting in the closet, but I need to get a snare & cymbals--I'd get kicked out of my apartment complex if I tied to play it. Hey, while I'm on that topic, dig this... One of my neighbors, who lives in the front unit at my apartment complex, sang in a band with "Mop Top" Mike Markesich in the 80s. He is originally from Connecticut and he knew all of the retro garage revival people playing in the Northeast at the time (the Chesterfield Kings, etc.). He was the one who told me all about Markesich and the gang. Pretty wild huh? Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:44, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
When you ever wanted to get started, I have a few delta blues acts you can write. I have so many I want to get to, but I am more than happy to give you a few to broaden your range here. Since we are saying which instruments we use, I'll tell you I play sitar. I know that is by no means a conventional instrument but ever since I found it in my father's storage I had to learn how to play. I feel a lot like Brian Jones on "Paint It Black" when he first experimented with the instrument.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 07:13, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
That is really interesting! I've always thought it would be an interesting instrument to learn to play, but I'd imagine that it has a completely different kind of neck-scale than a guitar. Brian Jones was such a multifaceted instrumentalist--he played practically kind of instrument under the sun. It is sad that he had to die so early, but he got caught up in such a terrible drug addiction. I wish there is something that could have been done to save him. I love the Stones in the Brian Jones years, and I also love them in the Mick Taylor years--those were their greatest periods in my mind. Strangely, I've never gotten as much into their stuff with Ron Wood, though some of it is alright pre-1983. I love Ron's stuff with the Birds and later Rod Stewart, Faces, etc. Man, when Rod Stewart and Ron Wood played together the sparks would really fly! I've been intending to expand my topics at some point--but I see that the garage stuff as so much in need of attention right now--it badly needs "triage." However, I do hope that I've brought a multi-dimensional perspective to this focus area, placing it in a broader socio-musical context. But, I want to do blues articles too--maybe you could mention some blues artists that you would like to see articles done on, and I could work on them. I'd be glad. Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:29, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm only into the Stones in the 60s and early 70s, even their psychedelic period was favorable to me, but blues rock and R&B is what suits them best. Aftermath, in my opinion, is one of the best 60s albums made, but people generally like Let it Bleed or Out of Our Heads more. I admire the album for Jones's experimentation with sitar, dulcimer, and organ, which is really evident on "Paint It Black" and "Lady Jane". As for the blues artists that need articles, a few that come to mind are Jimmy Wages, Sammy Lewis, and Eddie "One String" Jones. Wages is probably your best bet for Internet sources as the latter two I only looked in my books so far for sources. If Wages doesn't interest you, I can look through my list for others.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:01, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for providing those great blues artists. I am guessing that they are included on the Smithsonian Folkways anthology. I want to buy it, but I'm going to have to save up for a few months--I know it'll be worth the investment. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:14, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
No, unfortunately any of the musical acts remaining that I haven't created an article for are so obscure that literally the only thing known about them is their name and the song recorded. I can work with scare details but I need a little more than what sources are giving me in this instance. These artists I gave you were found in books, lesser-known compilation albums, and the Internet. Like I said, if you find you want more subjects just ask as I have over 50 blues artists on this list I've written down.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:36, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

Great! Hey one little thing: I noticed you put a colon in the title of volume one (which of course is fine as far as I'm concerned--I was actually thinking about doing the same thing, initially, but decided against it because of the exclamation point that is in the title--I was worried that the title might appear cumbersome or jumbled). But, I could put a colon in the future titles (for the next volumes)--and even later change the old titles (by moving them) to accommodate the inclusion of colons--the only thing is, is that if I do that, I have to bring up the issue first on the talk pages of the articles, and wait for people to weigh-in on it before I can proceed. It may not be important enough to worry about. And that is fine. But, you know I'm crazy for consistency (and I know you're the same way). We want to make sure that the whole series achieves uniformity, from volume to volume, that it doesn't look like a piecemeal stich job. Let's be sure to communicate in advance how the format things need be arranged, so we can get the consistent look we desire for the series. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:53, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

Yes I noticed it too late. I looked at your draft and saw the colon but the final product apparently does not have it. I'll leave it out for the rest of the albums. I can't change titles from my phone so if you know how to, I'd be ok with it for consistency.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:58, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

No problem, I could do that down the road, but its no biggie now. If you would like to see the colons just let me know (although it might be easier without, because we have so many done without 'em now) . Hey, when I did the first article (Vol. 10), I was considering putting the sub-heading in parenthesis next to the title but decided against it, because I felt it might become confusing and not be of much help to the reader and collector--so I decided to put the "Vol. #" right after the title to reflect the nomenclature and "shorthand," of buyers and collectors. So, what I did was put the subheading in the second or third sentence, as a way of describing the stylistic approach of music selected for each album--you'll notice I put a statement about that each time. By the way, I really like the way you did the descriptions for the songs in the second paragraph--you mention more stuff about the songs discussed in Allmusic, which I'll admit I was in too much of a rush to do--I'll go back and add of those details into the articles I did later this week. Believe it or not I haven't used my album liner notes yet, because I don't have Wi-Fi at my house--I'm always at coffee houses. I'm going to get that in later, though (and save up and get a Wi-Fi installed--how I long to be able to work in the comfort of home after a long day's work). Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:26, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

I can add in the volume numbers, I didn't even think about that. When I did the Pebbles series, it already had the volume number in the title so I didn't realize I missed that detail, though I still always write the installment. The colon doesn't need to be included, that was just a mistake on my part. I may have to depend on Allmusic for future articles because I only have the first two volumes that I borrowed from my friend. I think I can still include enough background info and musical highlights for the reader.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 04:20, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
Oh no problem at all, in fact normally I'd have used the colons, if it hadn't been for that exclamation point. Later, I need to get the track-times from my CD's which are at home (I hope that they're printed on the CD packages, as I'm guessing they are on the LP's). By the way, its encouraging see that your friend is also into groovy 60s music! Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:18, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
My friend's favorite band is the Human Beinz, I felt that was worth mentioning and I know you are well aware of their contributions to garage rock. I would have asked to borrow more of his albums, but I felt that would be kinda selfish since he was generous enough to lend me the first two. I'm going to start work on another album after I finish a brief article on this old western swing group called the East Texas Serenaders. What volume would you most prefer I do next? I see you completed yet another so I was thinking I could start on the tail end of the series, but I'd rather see your suggestion of direction first.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:53, 28 August 2015 (UTC)
Well, I could do the remainder of those I own, which are Vol. 9 Teen Jangler Blowout and Vol. 13 I'm Gonna Stay. I could then do Vol. 11. Then whichever ones you would like outside of those are fine with me, in any order you wish. If you are busy with other projects and would prefer I do a couple of extras, that would be fine too, just tell me which ones (additional) if need be. Occasionally you may wish to look beyond AllMusic. I did not find Unterberger's review of Vol. 6 (No One to Love) to be very helpful--he overlooked some of the best songs on that album, such as the Paragons' "Abba" and a couple of others that I (and many others) deem to be great songs. So I had to go to other sources. Garagepunk66 (talk) 16:55, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Yeah I know what you mean, sometimes Unterberger lets his own musical tastes get in the way of reviewing the totality of the music. It's sometimes very obvious which kind of musical artists he favors (just take a look at his reviews on the Electric Prunes and the Music Machine on his website or allmusic and you'll know what I mean). Not that those bands don't deserve praise, but I believe a review should be based on the music's quality, not his own personal tastes. As for the albums, I had a few projects but they can wait as I promised to make this a priority. This is a very important and high-quality album series so the sooner it's complete, the better. I'll work on Vol. 14 for now as it is one of my personal favorites.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 21:14, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

And of course, I still think Unterberger has done a lot of great writing, and I've found so much of his stuff to be valuable to use as resources--it's just that no one is perfect, I guess. By the way, I know that the article on Vol. 14 will be a great addition! Garagepunk66 (talk) 21:51, 28 August 2015 (UTC)
Oh no doubt Unterberger's writings are astounding. I have his books Unknown Legends of Rock N Roll and Urban Spacemen and Wayfaring Strangers, and I strongly recommend them if you don't already have them. Great details about many bands you would like and excellent sources (the first book was key to the Electric Prunes article). I really like his chapters on the Chocolate Watchband and the Music Machine. I also think Unterberger was especially fond of Sean Bonniwell, you can really tell in his interviews. It's a shame Bonniwell past away just as his music was starting to get the credit it deserved long ago.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 04:50, 29 August 2015 (UTC)
Bonnewell was an American genius--it is sad that he is with us no longer, but at least he is finally getting the credit he deserves. I just wish that he could still be here to reap it. So many 60s artists have now left us. I try to keep mindful that the remaining musicians are beginning to get up in their years, and are ever in need of appreciation and commemoration, more and more so by each passing day. These articles are our small ways of showing thanks to these wonderful people for what they have given us, though I realize that no one could ever do enough. Garagepunk66 (talk) 21:24, 29 August 2015 (UTC)
While I am on that sadder note, I must take a moment of reflection to think about Hurricane Katrina which hit my hometown exactly ten years ago this day. While we have come a long way since then and things have largely recovered, we can never forget those that didn't make it safely through--one of whom was the former drummer for Dr. Spec's Optical Illusion. So a big thanks to him! Garagepunk66 (talk) 21:47, 29 August 2015 (UTC)
I'm really glad we could make an article about his band. I was instantly in love with them when I heard their single. Unfortunately, no one was prepared for that disaster but that is why we need to learn from the hurricane to protect more people.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:21, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
Luckily we are more prepared today and much has been done to create better evacuation protocols, and we have a much better flood protection system in place surrounding us, though it is a work in progress that will probably take 30-50 years to get it to the highest benchmark. I'm a big proponent of costal restoration. Issues such as this are going to become more important all up and down the Atlantic cost. Hurricane Sandy was a tragedy, but it taught a lot. I believe that we can be cautiously optimistic for the future if everyone seizes the opportunities to plan ahead and do the right things which may not always be politically popular. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:19, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
Sandy was probably the first storm that I was effected by the damage. I can't imagine the difficulties southern and coastal states have to face almost on a yearly basis. It's sad that it takes disasters for people to realize that their initial strategies for protection or safety were flawed. Whether it's war, an airplane crash, or in this instance, a hurricane, it seems only then do we learn of the imperfections. It's even more sad that many things are left unfixed as a result of money or politics. Hopefully mankind will eventually learn to work for another rather than for the individual. By the way, I forgot my charger so I probably won't be able to edit tomorrow. I wanted to finish vol. 14 but I don't have much time.
P.S. you mentioned once that you wanted your user page to be similar in design to Ghmyrtle (I admit I copied his idea). I could structure it for you if you want, but I also understand if you'd rather do it yourself.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:08, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
I love copying from other editors--I do it all the time, and Ghmyrtle is a good one to copy from! The change in ordering of titles you mentioned is something I'd like switch to within the next year, but I don't feel that things are quite ready there yet. I definitely want to go that direction, for sure, but I need to get a good portfolio for each sub-category. One casualty of doing the G.R. article expansion this summer was that I missed out on the opportunity to do about thirty or forty articles which I probably would have done in that same time frame--don't get me wrong, I'm glad I did the G.R. thing, it is something I have dreamed of and cherished (and there's more to come there soon!)--it's just that it took me away from other things. In life, when you want something bad enough, you have to be willing make sacrifices. I'm kind of embarrassed to admit this, but I have to frankly admit that right now I have a really "skimpy" portfolio (largely as a result of the amount of time I put into the G.R. thing). If I tried to sub-divide the headings at this time, I'm afraid that it wouldn't look very good. But, in about six months, it might be a better time. Garagepunk66 (talk) 20:10, 31 August 2015 (UTC)
Oh it's not about the quantity, as long as your work has quality. As far as I'm concerned, you have always strived for quality and achieved it after extensive editing. Big projects do take their toll, which is why spreading out my work has always been my plan, but they are the most fulfilling. All I know is there are still many music artists that deserve a page here or a revision of a current article so there is going to be a lot to do here for a long time to come.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 20:49, 31 August 2015 (UTC)
Well, I want to do some smaller projects, now that the lions' share of additions to the the G.R. is behind. However I could also do some larger projects too--just as long as I don't have to do any more things with 300+ references for a good long while. But, I noticed that Wikipedia does not have an article about Coastal erosion in Louisiana. They mention a bit about the topic in the Wetlands of Louisiana article, but way too little is said there, and I am shocked that there is no standalone article on an issue which is paramount to the future survival of my region. So, I thought I'd do a crazy thing and take the law into my own hands--I'm doing an article on it in my Sandbox #7. I won't rush it, because I want to scout some really good sources. I'm not a scientist, and I consider myself more of an arts and culture writer... But, the Mississippi River geography is connected to music on a various levels. Think of how the Great Mississippi Flood of 1927 must have affected a lot of the blues singers in Mississippi--you'll notice biblical allusions to Noah and even the apocalypse in some of the songs. It is interesting that in disasters, the grotesquely surreal becomes actual reality. We saw that during 9-11 and in Sandy. I saw this when I walked around the lower Ninth Ward after Katrina--the extent of the destruction there was so great that it looked almost phantasmagoric when viewed from the ground. TV, even in widescreen, just cannot capture the scope of a disaster. You see little snapshots and hear commentary, but it it's so inadequate. But, music taps into so many things and does it much better than TV. Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:15, 31 August 2015 (UTC)
Well it's good you're branching out to make an important article for your region. I hope other wikipedians will welcome you into the more scientific aspects of this project. As for me, I've been meaning to write more articles about early alternate life advocates and poets, particularly those from Germany in the 1890s (the first hippies!). I wrote one awhile back and seeing you doing something different motivates me to do it again. It's funny you mentioned the flood in Mississippi because Blind Lemon Jefferson actually wrote a few songs about it. I'll need to listen to them again to see which ones, but it's cool to notice those connections. Unfortunately, he, like many fantastic black musicians, was never recognized for his progressive brand of blues until decades after his passing.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:32, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
Well, I guess you've been goading me on lately to do other kinds of articles--I actually take that as a compliment--you have recognized that I have a broad range of interests (as I know you do too). The main reason I've focused on the 60s music is that, like you, I believe that it is a valuable and under-documented contribution to humanity, which desperately needs to be more fully chronicled. It is people like us who keep the memory of this magical music alive, so that others will be able to have an opportunity to be inspired by it. But in a year or so, once I feel that we have finally been able to get a lot of this music chronicled, then I'll be able to stretch out more, which you have correctly interpreted that I plan to do. I'll still keep writing about 60s garage then, but I'll spread out the topics more and more. I follow not only my my interests, but also where I perceive there is a need. Garagepunk66 (talk) 17:07, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
Well I know you can improve a wide variety of articles and it allows you to collaborate with other editors. I am glad you will still keep writing 60s articles, it would get kinda lonely if you didn't. As you noticed very little wikipedians edit this kind of music unless it's on the big artists everyone know. The only time they seem to care is when they can potentially delete a page. Maybe when we broaden our horizons to other topics we may still find similar interests. I know after a year I wanted to place some focus on blues musicians, alternate lifestyles, and feminists as I have found these lack in some areas. That will be a long time from now as I still need to improve all the Jefferson Airplane albums and the band page itself.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:35, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
You don't need to worry. I will keep doing 60s articles until the last breath that is in me--it is so much ingrained in the fabric of my very being, in my heart and soul--they'd have to kill me to get me to stop writing about the 60s! You know that as long as the GP66's engine runs, my wheels will keep spinning out 60s jive! It may seem paradoxical--that on one hand I'm an ardent environmentalist, yet I love powerful 60s cars (talk about split personality)! In real life I'm a typical mundane person--you'd be surprised that I drive a Toyota. But in my imagination I'm cruising around in a '66 GTO! My solution is that if I ever have the money to by a classic car, I can take it on a Sunday drive, but the rest of the time use a Toyota. So, in the inverse, I can occasionally write about and "serious" topic, but the rest of the time I'm gonna write about cool music! Forever! Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:54, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

That is good, it would be a shame to lose such a knowledgable contemporary. By the way, when we finish the Teenage Shutdown series (I'll do the last volume next) I had an idea to create the album series for Garage Beat '66, which was released by Sundazed Records. We can start that whenever there isn't any other major priorities since there is no big rush.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 03:05, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

I had thought about that too. Luckily, I have all of the CD's in GB66 series. Also, there are no articles for albums in the Back from the Grave series--there is only a lead-out article. So, I was thinking that we could work on those too. With Back from the Grave, the LP's and CD's are in two completely different configurations, under different volumes--so we could do separate sets of articles on the LP albums and on the CD albums. I have all of the CD's in the series, including the latest (Vol. 9 & 10). We could divvy it all up in halves. Which series would you like to do first after we finish the Teenage Shutdown? Oh, I might fit some time in to do the Psychedelic garage section for the G.R. article. I think you will love it, because it "springboards" a lot of thoughts about the 60s in the broader sociological and philosophical framework, which I think the article ultimately has to address--it has to somehow locate garage's place in the whole 60s experience, and that is where the article, architecturally and thematically speaking, will reach a grand climax. At first, I thought I was crazy (and thought I'd leave it in the hanger), but now I'm finding direct sources to confirm all of this stuff--from garage sources. But, I promise not to go overboard--I'll make sure to get it just right. Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:47, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
The GB66 series would probably be the best to start with since I also have the complete series. I have six of the CDs for Back from the Grave so my collection is not nearly as large. I spent most of my time tracking down all the Pebbles LPs and CDs, which took me four years to complete. I will definitely look Foward to the psychedelic garage section when you finish it. No rush though as I know that it takes a lot of work to keep piecing the article together.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 03:59, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
That's perfect. We could do the GB66 series next. Garagepunk66 (talk) 14:48, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
By the way, I have this great recommendation for this band from the Netherlands called the Zipps. While I urge you to look into all their recordings, "When You Tell It, Tell it Well" is in my opinion their best.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 23:07, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
I can't wait to check them out! Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:09, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

And just a suggestion, but when you update your user space you could "decorate" by adding a top ten albums list. My version that I updated for the first time is a top ten psychedelic albums list but yours can encompass any genre you like. I'd be really interested in your choices, though I understand the difficulty of containing favorites to just a list of ten.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 03:50, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

I have a bunch of favorite albums, usually by bigger-name 60s artists--it's hard to pick a top ten, because I have so many favorites. I guess the tragedy with the garage and underground psych is that so few bands ever got the chance to record a full album, so with them I have to think more in terms of compilations. I have some favorite comps though. One really obscure compilation I particularly love is Quagmire Vol. 1. I have the CD--you may find it on eBay, but it's rare. There are a some other good ones in that series as well, as well as other series. I'd love to do articles some of the really obscure comps series, but lack of good sources may present a problem in safeguarding against deletionists. I like how you said that the only time some of those editors ever bother to take notice of obscure 60s bands is when deletion time rolls around. Garagepunk66 (talk) 21:53, 3 September 2015 (UTC)
I actually have volume 2 of that series, but like you said finding others is extremely rare. I just made a top ten because it brings up nice debates, particularly one I had with Ghmyrtle a while back. I will never be swayed from Crown of Creation, it was one of Jefferson Airplanes's best works, but it is commonly overlooked. I wish I could say the comps could have articles, but they would be easy targets for deletionists. I understand Wikipedia can't just have a page for every 60s band or album, but sometimes editors are just ignorant to the topic's worth. I probably have a bias, considering all my experiences with potential deletions are from a user who just wanted to ruin my time here.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 03:26, 4 September 2015 (UTC)
Well, you need not worry about that "misguided" editor now. I don't have Vol. 2 of Quagmire, but I'd like to find it (if it is still available), as well as 4 and 5. The ones I have (in addition to Vol. 1) are Vol 3, Vol. 6, Vol. 7, and Vol. 8. Volume 1 and 7 are my two favorites, but particularly Vol. 1 for some reason--it really captures the magic of the whole era. Garagepunk66 (talk) 16:33, 4 September 2015 (UTC)
Yeah it took longer than it should, but he's been dealt with appropriately. I think volume 2 is one of the better comps I own, but I'd like to get other albums from the series before I compare it. Personally, my favorite comp album is Beyond the Calico Wall because it has a good variation of psychedelia. I wish it became an actual series, it could have potentially been one of the best avaliable in my opinion.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 19:16, 4 September 2015 (UTC)
I need to get Beyond the Calico Wall. It must be really incredible! Garagepunk66 (talk) 21:19, 4 September 2015 (UTC)
I was wondering if you heard of this Louisiana garage group called the Basement Wall? If not, than I recommend "Never Existed" or their cover of "(We Ain't Got) Nothin' Yet". They may just be one of the best Louisiana bands I've encountered and they will soon be the subject of one of my articles. Also, I wanted to use this opportunity to thank you for your collaborative efforts with me. I say this because my next article marks #100, which is a milestone I never thought I'd reach. If I didn't have someone else who shared my passion, this wouldn't have been possible.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:19, 5 September 2015 (UTC)
Well I want to say congratulations at reaching the hundredth and thank you for your kind words to me, though I take no credit. I love the Basement Wall too--they were fantastic and were upriver from Baton Rouge. I'm guessin' you've probably spun "Nerver Existed on your Garage Beat 66 Vol. 5 CD (Vol. 5 and 7 are my two favorites). They sometimes wore white Beatle boots, something I've never seen any other band do. My friend in the Gaunga Dyns was good friends with their keyboardist. Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:21, 5 September 2015 (UTC)

Well I need to give you some of the credit for the article opportunities you showed me. I would have searched for all the great Lousiana bands if I did not discuss them with you or write album articles for Teenage Shutdown. You are correct for guessing where I heard the Basement Wall and I think it's so cool there are still these connections between music artists after all these years. It kinda reminds of the companionship San Francisco bands had in their prime when they guested on one another's albums or were friends sharing each other's ideas. That's something I think we lost when music became too commercial.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 19:34, 5 September 2015 (UTC)

Your're definitely right. For instance when bands went to L.A., they'd stay at some of the motels on La Cienaga Blvd., and even the local musicians would go hang out with visiting artists. For instance, Jimi Hendrix, Neil Young, and Alice Cooper might have been hanging out at the same motel. I know that Jim Morrison loved those Motels. Even after he made a lot of money and could have lived anywhere he wanted, he loved going to dive bars and hanging out at all of those places. I don't know about now, but I imagine that, then, all of the places in L.A. had that "look." I love the signs and architecture from that time--the signs with the blinking lights, the mom and pop hamburger stands, the roadside places, etc. Nearly all of it has been demolished in the last thirty years, which is a tragedy. And, of course you know how much I love the cars form that time, which were architectural gems. It's funny how quickly my environmentalism goes out the window when I see a 60s car. Right now, there is a '69 Camaro SS parked outside of the coffee house where I am banging out these words. I went up and looked at it a few minutes ago and my jaws just dropped--my little "garage rat" heart started pounding. I couldn't help it. My "garage rat" condition is incurable! Garagepunk66 (talk) 19:51, 5 September 2015 (UTC)
Excellent article on Bohemian Vendetta. It may just be one of your best yet. I actually learned a lot more than I expected from the article, considering they are one of my favorite garage bands. I particularly enjoy their cover of "(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction", but their whole album is a true masterpiece.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 22:32, 5 September 2015 (UTC)
Well, coming from someone who has written so many wonderful things, that's a huge compliment! Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:35, 5 September 2015 (UTC)

Hey, you'll notice that I just changed (moved) the title for the first Teenage Shutdown, removing the colon that had been the title, so it is now consistent with the others in the series. I was wondering if you would like me to go in and make some changes in the ones you did to make the whole series more consistent: I was thinking that I could put a reference to the "Volume #" in the first sentence of each, because that is the "lingo" collectors and fans use to refer to it--the official titles are too long for people to pronounce, so in the ones I did, I included the "volume #'s" in the fist sentence to be helpful to readers. Then, I put the subheadings (or subtitles) a sentence down--to coincide with a description of the stylistic preoccupation of each volume--thus conveying that info. along to the reader. If you would like, after I do that, I could put the subheadings in bold in the lower sentence. I could remove the (see: year in music) and instead put a blue link to it in the release year is mentioned in the sentence. My reckoning is that garage collectors probably don't care much for most music from 1998--that year is more for the Ricky Martin crowd. I thought I could put some stuff about Tim Warren and Mike Markesich in the opening paragraph, because I think it is vital background info. I thought we could put the city and state for each band in the track listings, as a way to showcase band. But, I appeal to your understanding here--please don't be mad. If you don't want me to make these changes, just tell me--I would never even think about making those changes if you din't want me too. And by the way, I think you did a great job on the ones you did, it is just about making the series more uniform. I even made a lot of changes to mine to reflect some of your ideas. For instance I added Month and day dates to go along with year wherever dates were mentioned. I like that you put track times on yours, so I added that to all of mine, when possible to get that info. I also started going into more discussion about the songs as I saw you do--though I have to admit that I still need to go back and embellish that on some of the first ones I did. So, let me emphasize that I've made some changes, whenever I thought what you did was better. So I acknowledge that. We could use this kind format on future comps, taking into account the best ideas we have both come up with, which would be a killer formula. Also: I'm working on a lead-out article for the GB66 series, but no rush--you can get to that series later if you're busy on other projcets--I'm working on some other things too. And also, once again, I congratulate you on your hundredth new article. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:33, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for the update. Some of the format changes you want can be made, but just note that it is highly recommended to have the ("see" year in music) after the release date. The rest such as subtitles have less specifics so I'm assuming as long as they are mentioned, it is ok to alter them. Sorry my format did not fit with the rest of the albums. After being trained by another user in a certain style, I have grown a little too accustomed to it. But go ahead and make any changes to the articles. I don't own them and I trust you 100%. I will try to get to the GB66 series soon, but I wanted to finish some other projects I've left on hold for awhile.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:15, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
No problem, you did a great job. A lot of this is subjective and is up to the judgment of good editors--and man are we good or what? I would say that the year in music (parenthetical clause) should be inserted when dealing with an album of all-new material released in its own time--in that case, the music is emblematic of its period and is therefore part of the whole milieu. For instance, I bet you were doing an article on, say, a Janis Joplin or Joe Cocker album released in 1969 or the Incredible String Band form 1967--I bet that's where you got the advice! Cant't prove it, but I bet! That's where it would be absolutely de rigeur. Whereas, when dealing with a compilation of music from an earlier (and, quite frankly, antithetical) era, its a whole different ballgame. So, maybe on retrospective comps, it might be best to blue-link the year, but say little else. And by the way thank you for expressing your trust--your good opinion of my editorship means so much, because its coming from someone I have the absolute highest respect. We know that we are really good editors (well, not yet Ghmyrtle, but gettin' there, ...one day), but as human beings, we never think we're good enough, and we all want to be validated and acknowledged, even Crazy Aces (but I better not get onto that topic). Happy Labor Day! Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:18, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
Correct, I began using that style with the Incredible String Band albums. I should have taken into account that these are compilations, not studio albums. Let's not bring CA back into memory though, he likes looking over my interaction with other users to look for any excuse to bring me to ANI. He's not nearly as active (only seems to return to try and save an irrelevant article he made), but I'd rather not go through the trouble he brings. It's a shame too, if he just listened to other editors who only wanted to help, CA could have been a helpful contributor to the project. Accepting help is exactly why we grew as editors, and why we will be here for a long time.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 06:35, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
Hey, I just finished the lead-out article for the GB66 series. But, no rush. We can take our time. Garagepunk66 (talk) 17:49, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
P.S.Please excuse my occasional facetious remarks--you've noticed I love the sport of jests and wisecracks, but I don't want that to get anyone in trouble. However, I do hope you find my "japes" amusing just the same. Garagepunk66 (talk) 17:49, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
Oh it's no trouble, I do find it amusing. I just don't want CA to give you any of the headaches he gave me for months. Thanks for the tweeking to the Roy Hall article. I didn't make those headings, but I guess they are fine being there. I also didn't expect the editing it got soon after, which I'm hoping is a positive. Honestly, I think its been a little butchered, I'm not a fan of those lengthy quotes that don't really say enough to validate the space, but at least editors are taking some notice.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 18:03, 7 September 2015 (UTC)
Block quotes are just fine if they convey necessary insights and don't overwhelm an article. I've put some block quotes in some of the articles I've started up, which I admit are fewer articles than I would have liked to have done (and I'm sure that probably wouldn't seem like that many to you)...but I ask for your understanding in this regard (as I recognize your accomplishments, I hope that you won't see mine as being anything less). For a long time I was preoccupied with that whole G.R. expansion. I doubt that even most master editors have ever attempted a project that large in scale (converted to Microsoft Word, the G.R. article is now 116 pages, in 12-pt. Times New Roman, double space, almost 400 refs.). I know someone working on her PhD, and she told me that she has 110 references in her now almost-finished dissertation--she "flipped" when I told her how many references I added to the G.R.! I banged out the Bohemian Vendetta article in a couple of hours, yet it took me almost a week just to do the Australian section (alone) in the G.R. Every editor establishes his or her own benchmarks based on the context of their situation, so for me the G.R. has been a big part my personal benchmark so far, but I am finally beginning to move onto a lot of the other things I had wanted to do. Garagepunk66 (talk) 20:08, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

I realize how they can be effective, I guess I'm just not much of a fan for block quotes. You've made a nice variety of articles, considering you were on one project for a long time. You may not credit yourself, but I give you a lot of credit for articles I made, particularly those about Louisiana bands and the Teenage Shutdown series. I would have never started those if we never discussed the fact Lousiana had such an amazing garage rock scene. After I finished my editing for Just Another Diamond Day, I will be able to contribute to the Garage Beat 66 series and help complete the Teenage Shutdown! series.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 22:17, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for your constructive ideas for diversifying the references in the G.R, which I will definitely put in there, provided they can be found. While I'm at it, I thought that I could create another thread--this one is getting long--I should send this section to the archive. Garagepunk66 (talk) 16:17, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
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