User:Sluzzelin/sandbox for IS

Words spelled exactly the same way in different languages, but with entirely different meanings

This is somewhat related to false friends and false cognates, but here is what I am actually looking for:

A string of letters which exists as a word in various languages using the Latin alphabet, but has an entirely different meaning and, if possible, different etymology, in each language. Specifically, I'm looking for examples exceeding three different languages.

Example for three languages: "rot" (can mean purefaction (noun) in English, red (adjective) in German, or burp (noun) in French).

I don't care about capital letters (so, it can be a noun in German, e.g.), but it shouldn't use diacritics in any of the foreign languages. Thank you very much in advance! ---Sluzzelin talk 11:22, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Wiktionary is organized well for checking candidates. For example, it tells me that rot has different meanings again in Norwegian, Swedish, and Tok Pisin. Algebraist 11:26, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for that, Algebraist! (no idea why I didn't think of it). I'm happy to see that "rot" seems to be a good choice. I will check more candidates on wiktionary. Still, if anyone happens to think of other examples, I'd really appreciate it! ---Sluzzelin talk 12:46, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

However, Wiktionary does care about capital letters, even if you don't: wikt:rot and wikt:Rot are different entries. +Angr 13:43, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Car means "car" in English, "cart" in Romanian, "because" in French, "dear" or "expensive" in Catalan, and "tsar" in several Slavic languages (e.g., Polish). — Kpalion^(talk) 14:23, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Only 2 languages, but dick means, well, dick in English and thick in German. Cracks me up. Aaadddaaammm (talk) 14:27, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Cap means "cap" in English, "head" in some Romance languages (e.g., Catalan, Romanian), "male goat" in some Slavic languages (e.g., Polish, Slovak), and "seal" or "stamp" in Indonesian. — Kpalion^(talk) 14:36, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Pies means "pies" in English, "feet" in Spanish, "magpies" in French, "dog" in Polish, and "(I) piss" in Dutch. — Kpalion^(talk) 14:44, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Pole means "pole" in English, "field" in Polish, "he polishes" in Spanish, "isn't" in Estonian, and "slowly" in Swahili. — Kpalion^(talk) 15:01, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

I think it would more fun to try and find the longest word of this kind. So far I couldn't come up with anything longer than four letters. — Kpalion^(talk) 15:03, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Oh, one question, Sluzzelin: do you accept words written in other alphabets which look like words written in the Latin alphabet? Such as Russian сор ("garbage, dirt"), which happens to look like сор (English "cop", Catalan "hit", Czech "braid", French "pal").— Kpalion^(talk)

"cop" in Russian is the Cyrillic alphabet, so that wouldn't count, or it would be in a different category. The "c" is more like an "s", I think, and the "p" is definitely an "r", as with the Greek letter "rho". ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 15:46, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

I know, that's why I'm asking the OP if it counts or not. — Kpalion^(talk) 15:56, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

"Gift" famously means poison in German [1], but it does seem to be difficult to find longer words, though I can think of some homophones.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 15:39, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

According to my dictionaries, the German for "to give" is "geben", which makes sense, but the word for gift is "Geschenk". I wonder about the etymology of "Gift" (verb form "vergiften") and "Geschenk". I can't think of any English cognates for those two. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 16:00, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Gift is a wonderful example of what we're collecting right now, because it means both "poison" and "married" in all Danish, Faroese, Norwegian, and Swedish; "poison" in German; and "donation" in Dutch. Note that all of those languages belong to the Germanic branch of the Indo-European language family, exactly as English does. --Магьосник (talk) 20:50, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

I was thinking about chore, five letters, but it seems to mean different things in only three languages (English, Polish and Portuguese), not above Sluzzelin's threshold. — Kpalion^(talk) 15:43, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Sometimes a conjugated Latin word looks like a different English word; one that springs to mind is "emit", which means "he bought". The English word comes from Latin, but from a completely different word. Also "dies", which means "day", and has two different meanings in English. (There are more, maybe some longer than four letters, but I'll have to think about it.) Adam Bishop (talk) 19:36, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Some others - "grates" is a word for "thanks" in Latin, and the English word comes from a different Latin word ("cratis", where we also get "crate"). A good one that is purely Germanic is "reddens". In Latin that means "giving back". Also "dares" which in Latin is "you might give". Adam Bishop (talk) 19:54, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

(Of course, now I see you were looking for three or more languages, sorry...but to add to the "pole" list above, it is also the vocative of "polus" in Latin, if for some reason you wanted to address the sky.) Adam Bishop (talk) 20:20, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

A good one (though rather short): baba means "father" in Albanian and Turkish; "old woman" in Polish and Serbian; and "drool" in Portuguese and Spanish. --Магьосник (talk) 21:19, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

A five letter one, baste, with five languages, English, Dutch (part of the verb bassen to bark), Sami (spoon), French (either an interjection, or something to do with card games), Spanish (part of the verb bastar, to suffice) and Norwegian (bind or tie - at least in my 1964 edition dictionary). Mikenorton (talk) 23:09, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

We have for some reason forgotten about inflected forms. They may give a lot of examples. English surrender means "surrender", but German surrender is a present active participle meaning "buzzing", as in ein surrender Bienenschwarm, "a buzzing swarm of bees". Turkish emerim means "I suck", but Latin emerim means "I may/should/would have bought". I'm sure many, many more ones could be found, one just has to know enough languages well enough. :P --Магьосник (talk) 12:45, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

Thank you, everyone, for your wonderful suggestions! Responding to Kpalion: I hadn't even considered Cyrillic variations. I guess I originally would not have allowed them, but this makes for a wonderful twist. I will be weaving a lot of your suggestions into a puzzle I am preparing for my Dad, a logophiliac whose 70th birthday is coming up. Thank again! ---Sluzzelin talk 10:27, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

I just found one more: aber can mean "monkeys", "but", "estuary" or "submerged river valley". — Kpalion^(talk) 08:41, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

Looking for a useful audio-guide on accents/dialects from Great Britain and Ireland

Title says it all; I've learned to distinguish and localize certain types of American English, but remain clueless on the differences among people from the British Isles. I only found youtube clips by self-professed accent-imitators covering the entire Anglosphere, but some of their American accents sounded pretty phony even to my ears, and I don't trust the authenticity of their other imitations.

Alternatively, if there is not one source covering all, I'd be equally grateful for links to people (characters in film or on TV, politicians, etc) speaking a certain dialect in a typical and unadultered fashion. I want to learn to identify them as specifically as reasonably possible (i.e. beyond "Scottish" or "Irish", which I can usually already recognize). Thank you very much. ---Sluzzelin talk 07:43, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

The first three external links at Dialect appear to be relevant to what you are seeking.

-- Wavelength (talk) 08:15, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Try this site: [2]

--TammyMoet (talk) 09:48, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

The soap operas offer a good starting point. Eastenders has some reasonably accurate cockney voices, Emmerdale has some of the more local Yorkshire accents, Brookside used to do Liverpudlian accents and Coronation Street is just rubbish. For Geordie look up Byker Grove. For famous people with distinctive regional voices (England)I would say Lily Savage, Harry Redknapp, Fred Dibnah (or Peter Kay), Jimmy Nail (or Ant and Dec), Liam Gallagher, Russel Howard (think he's Bristol accent?) and then the guy from Auf Wiedersehn Pet that sounds Brummie. 194.221.133.226 (talk) 15:41, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Russell Howard has a slight Bristol accent - but he does sometimes put on a stronger one for comedic effect. Jethro has a Cornish accent. DuncanHill (talk) 15:49, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

The guy from Auf Wiedersehen Pet who sounds Brummie is actually Timothy Spall, and he learnt the accent for the part. I agree he does sound authentic, but if you'd like to hear a Brummie accent, you need to hear Adrian Chiles (who is reasonably well-spoken but it still comes out from time to time), Frank Skinner (who is actually Black Country), or Carl Chinn (who gets called a "professional Brummie" from time to time...) hope this helps!--TammyMoet (talk) 18:41, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Michael Parkinson does a fair job of a typical Yorkshire accent. -- JackofOz (talk) 19:17, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

If you want to hear a proper Liverpool accent, you'd be wanting to watch Boys from the Black Stuff by Alan Bleasdale. You'd be getting a decent representation there. Brookside is no longer on telly anymore.--KageTora (talk) 19:45, 10 December 2008 (UTC)--KageTora (talk) 19:45, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Thanks to everyone for the pointers. I will eventually copy and re-organize this thread into userspace, for more in-depth exploration during the holiday season, so please keep adding! ---Sluzzelin talk 18:53, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

There are the Wallace and Gromit claymations where Wallace is voiced as a Northerner by Peter Sallis who also appears in Last of the Summer Wine set in Yorkshire. The accents are different according to the articles and the area is diverse anyway. Any shorts by Aardman Animations provide a range of British accents. Example, Creature Comforts with Victor the Geordie mouse and others. Then there's the Beatles for Liverpool of course. From Oasis (Manchester) Noel Gallagher speaks on YouTubeYouTube - Noel Gallagher on Russell Brand Radio Show.avi. Malcolm McLaren is London, while Johnny Rotten is housing estate North London, circa 1970s, and if you catch The Bill you'll find the housing estate accent has changed to a subtle mix (W'appen?). Don't forget Ali G for British wigger. Julia Rossi (talk) 22:14, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Whatever Happened to the Likely Lads? for James Bolam's Geordie. DuncanHill (talk) 22:39, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

The Archers (radio) for English Midlands. It's bound to still play somewhere. If you can't find in on BBC reruns, try BFBS. 76.97.245.5 (talk) 01:10, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Thanks again! ---Sluzzelin talk 08:31, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

"[:The F] is not a perfect piece, but from certain aspects it is nevertheless very fine, for here the music is not the docile servant of the dance. And at times you hear altogether unusual combinations of rhythms!" - Jacques Durand, Lettres de C.D. à son éditeur (Paris: Durand, 1927, trans by Morgenstern, p 80)

"I've recently seen S ... He says: my F, my S, like a child saying: my top, my hoop. And that's exactly what he is: a spoiled child who, on occasion, gives music a tweak on the nose. He's also a young savage who wears loud ties, and kisses the ladies' hands while stepping on their feet. When old, he'll be unbearable, that is to say, he won't be able to bear any kind of music; but, for the moment, he's incredible. He professes a great friendship for me, because I've helped him climb a height from which he can hurl grenades, which don't all explode. But, as I say, he's incredible." - C. D.: Lettres, ed. François Lesure (Paris: Hermann, 1980, trans by Fisk, p270)

"For us scurvy troublemakers, I S is one of the most remarkable geniuses ever to have existed in music. The lucidity of his mind has set us free; his fighting strength has won us rights that we can never lose again. That is a fact. His penetrating power is sharper than that of D and cannot be blunted; it is too finely tempered. S has so many different methods, such a sense of inventiveness, that one can only be amused. -The Writings of E.S. ed. & trans. Nigel Wilkins (London: Eulenberg, 1980, p84)

One of the characteristics of S's music is its "transparency of sound." This quality is always to be found in the works of pure masters, who never allow "left-overs" to be heard in their music -- leftovers that you will meet all the time in the "musical material" of the Impressionist composers, and even of certain Romantics, alas! ... Where S reveals to us the utter richness of his musical power is in his use of "dissonance". Here he declares himself and plunges us into a vast intellectual ecstasy. What a superb magician! For him, "dissonance" means "increased pressure," and through it he "leans" on the sensibility of the appreciative listener. The "dissonance" is in no way harsh: it takes place "in the wings," all shimmering, but always with a function. -The Writings of E.S. ed. & trans. Nigel Wilkins (London: Eulenberg, 1980, p96)

At one time he will toy with jazz, at another time with Bach and Beethoven seen through a distorted mirror. Or he will amuse himself by adding piquant "wrong notes" to the complacent beauty of Pergolesi. This seems to be not the work of a serious composer, but rather that of the too clever craftsman, one might almost say, the feats of the precocious child. --R.V.W., National Music (London: Oxford University Press, 1934, p 102)