Talk:List of Scouts/Archive 1

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Title

Should be List of famous Scouts, as Scout would be capitalized. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 17:06, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

Since the intro refers to Eagle rank and the BSA, this should be List of famous American Scouts. Zaian 18:24, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

Evrik: If you insist on List of notable Scouts, then you have to get rid of: "These notable individuals were Scouts or Scouters, but did not complete the Eagle Rank in the Boy Scouts of America (BSA)." as that is BSA-centric, plus you have no non-BSA people on the list, otherwise, put it back to the name I had. Rlevse 09:50, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

I think, you should do two things, if you want to maintain the article as List of nable Scouts. First remove the BSA-sentence; it excludes everybody outside of BSA from being a notable Scout (or Guide). Second please insert some international content.
With the actual content, the title is misleading. --jergen 17:09, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
  • I don't have the time to make the edits today, but will get to it early next week. FWIW, if there had been greater discussion about this before rlevese made the change I would have made it a higher priority to rework the page. evrik 22:10, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

I've moved all the BSA content into a subsection. Other sections can be added for other countries. Zaian 08:50, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

    • Thank you. I encourage everyone to expnad this page. evrik 16:47, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Evrik: what I don't understand yet: this article is for just famous scouts of nowadays, or in the history? --Kun25 10:57, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Other languages

There is now a page in:


I have tried to generate interest in the list on these pages:

and these pages as well:


The Spanish page, es:Lista_de_scouts_notables, has been deletd 2x. --evrik 16:58, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Inclusion

Is this list only for notables who were Scouts as a youth, or does it also include Scouters? --Gadget850 ( Ed) 18:08, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Good question. I think we've not ever established that. Hmmm....Rlevse 18:12, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
    • The number of notable BSA Scouters is enormous. Then there are honoraries, like every US president. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 18:16, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
      • I have no preference. --evrik 20:44, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
      • I think exclude honoraries, include all kinds of scouts and scouters but only the most notable. And there must be some balance between the US and non-US scouts on the list. --Egel Reaction? 12:23, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
        • I'm going to disagree on the balance question. If the BSA gets too big, then it should be split to a new article. --Gadget850 ( Ed)
        • Balance is a question of how many wikipedians are active on the page. If most users active on the page are US and hence know more about US Scouts, that's no reason to limit the US size, but a call to non-US users to update the sections they are familiar with. I agree with Gadget that if the US section gets big enough, just split it off. Rlevse 12:48, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

There seems to be too much negative focus (in print) on who didn't complete their Eagle or some other high award. This is not scout-like. Either someone fits on one list or another, and should be listed as such without rhetorical comments regarding what they "did not" accomplish. The fact that they were a Scout is terrific enough, and if they reached "Eagle" or some other high award, simply put them on that list. User:Wikibones

Section titles

Currently the titles use "in", for example "List of notable Scouts in Canada". In my opinion this should be "from". For example, Rich Little and Michael J Fox now live in and are associated with the US. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 18:40, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Actually, we can avoid all of that by simply listing the country. This also puts the titles into compliance with the Wikipedia:Manual of Style (headings) guideline- "Avoid restating the subject of the article or of an enclosing section in heading titles." --Gadget850 ( Ed) 21:22, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
agreed - just that country in each section title should be sufficient... people reading the article already know its a list... Horus Kol Talk 16:09, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Photo

There is a photo in the article without a caption. --Jagz 23:42, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

  • fixed. --evrik (talk) 21:00, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

BSA / GSUSA

  • Is it time to fork the BSA list?
  • Is it time to fork the GSUSA list

--Gadget850 ( Ed) 22:41, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

What about:

  • "San Antonio, Troop 90". Retrieved 2010-06-30.
  • Gonzalez, Charlie (2010-06-30). 2010 Hispanic Leadership Awards (Speech). Washington, D.C. {{cite speech}}: |access-date= requires |url= (help); More than one of |author= and |last= specified (help)

Newport Backbay (talk) 21:05, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

unexplained redlinks

I propose to remove all redlinks that are without explanations of who a person is or their importance. I am tired of those who nominate themselves and sifting out a junk listing because someone cannot be bothered to explain who that redlink is. Chris 21:38, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

I was thinking that as well. We should develop criteria similar to List of Eagle Scouts (Boy Scouts of America) and flush this out. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 23:11, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
something like this? --Egel Reaction? 11:21, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Yes—that looks familiar.  :-)--Gadget850 ( Ed) 11:53, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Criteria and formatting

This is a list of Scouts and Guides who are considered notable for their actions throughout their life. While many other lists abound, they are usually oriented towards a certain point of view, either positive or negative. This list strives to maintain the fundamental Wikipedia principle of a neutral point of view.

Criteria for inclusion and removal

  • To be included on the list, the person must be a verified Scout or Guide and must be notable.
  • If the Scout or Guide already has a Wikipedia article then he immediately meets the notability standard and should be added to the list with a link to the article.
  • An appropriate citation is encouraged for all entries.
  • An appropriate citation is required for a Scout or Guide without a Wikipedia article to be added to the list. Development of an article is encouraged.
  • A person can meet the notability test for either positive or negative reasons. Adding or deleting an entry simply because they are "fallen" is POV.
  • If an Scout or Guide with an article is thought to be non-notable, then the article should be recommended for deletion per articles for deletion. If the article is deleted, then the Scout or Guide in question is considered to be non-notable and the entry will be removed from the list.
  • Fictional Scouts and Guides should be added to Scouting in popular culture.
  • Eagle Scouts (Boy Scouts of America) should be added to List of Eagle Scouts (Boy Scouts of America).


Entry formatting The entry should be formatted as:

  • name
  • space (deceased); if they are dead
  • semicolon
  • Description: Use a complete sentence with the initial letter capitalized and ending with a period. Wikify, but don't repeat previous links. Put current positions first; use former or retired for previous positions unless they are deceased.
  • Citations: Citations use the cite.php format and reference template. See Wikipedia:WikiProject Scouting/References.

Discussion

It seems to me that some people are more noteworthy for being Scouts than for being Eagle Scouts and those truly famous people should be listed on this main page and linked to their eagle scout listing. Hence why I added Neil Armstrong when it seemed unbalanced that Buzz Aldrin was there and I had not looked at the eagle Scout list. Or maybe a separate page for the 'most famous scouts' ?? Lancechapel (talk) 11:48, 9 February 2010 (UTC)
Not sure how you are going to judge "most famous". The standard is Wikipedia:Notability (people). ---— Gadget850 (Ed) talk 12:21, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Name change

The name of this article was changed when I wasn't looking. The name was changed without any discussion. I propose we change it back. --evrik (talk) 15:29, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

agree The edit history shows the reasoning is listed at Wikipedia:Lists (stand-alone lists)#Naming conventions. Frankly, that section is not well written and there is no rationale, but I presume that since everything on Wikipedia should be notable, we don't need to use notable and the like in titles. As I see it, not using "List of notable xxxx" opens the article to a lot of spurious edits. This should have been discussed before changing an established article. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 16:20, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

Lists

Famous Girl Scouts: [1] --— Gadget850 (Ed) talk - 15:22, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

Australian Scouts: [2] --— Gadget850 (Ed) talk - 12:22, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

J. Percy Ross

I had added J. Percy Ross to this list since someone had decided to delete him from a list of people with the name of Ross. While his name was on that list the only info provided was he was(is) a prominent Canadian, and the a recipient of the Bronze Wolf from the World Organization of the Scout Movement in 1978.

I've done some surfing and found he is mentioned on these two pages related to scouting:

I also found him on this website:

I've never started an article, but I don't mind fixing them... ah, spell check, grammar, etc. I know he doesn't have an article, yet but there are lots of names on this list (about 1/3) that don't so I don't know why he was deleted so fast!!! As you may notice, I've added him back.

In case you are wondering what my interest is, my surname is Ross. Thats how I found J. Percy. CubBC (talk) 09:03, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

You must tell why he is important to Canada, lots of people are awarded the Bronze Wolf, who was he outside of that? Chris (クリス • フィッチ) (talk) 01:14, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

Honorary Scouts

Should Honorary Scouts be in this article or only people who have been a active Scout or Scouter? I think only who have been a active Scout or Scouter. --Egel Reaction? 09:51, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

That list of honorary Scouts had been on my todo list for some time since I found it listed in the 1933 handbook. These are people who were associated with the BSA in some manner, while not actually members; they either promoted Scouting or were used by the BSA as role models. There are a lot of other members not yet listed who held mostly honorary positions within the BSA, such as Chief Scout Woodsman Gifford Pinchot, Chief Scout Citizen Theodore Roosevelt and so on. Perhaps it is time to split the BSA list. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) talk - 13:48, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

First Scout

The first Scout of the history was William F. Cody, but he is not in the list. - W'oyikil —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.214.229.16 (talk) 23:54, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

This is a list of Scouts— those who are part of the Scouting youth movement — as opposed to military scouts; see Scouting and reconnaissance. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) talk - 23:59, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

List of Presidents of the United States involved in Scouting

I have started a draft version of this at Talk:List of Scouts/List of Presidents of the United States involved in Scouting please help to expand it. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) talk - 18:45, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

References

I have not had this on my watchlist and have not come across it before. This list is a complete mess. Hardly anything is sourced. All redlinks should be removed for a start and we should at least make sure that the blue links are actually to an article that states that the person is actually a Scout. This list is embarrassing. Why not just delete it? --Bduke (Discussion) 11:54, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Exactly. That's why I tagged the article. I suggest giving the article a couple of weeks for regular authors to sort it out, then go in and delete any non-referenced entries. --TimTay (talk) 12:47, 19 February 2009 (UTC)
The problem is, no one has "adopted" this article. To be a FL, and my personal rule, is, all entries on a list should have an article an ref. — Rlevse • Talk • 13:11, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

OK, so more than two weeks have passed and no significant change in the references. As this is an encyclopaedia and everything is unreferenced I am going to remove every unreferenced person in this list. --TimTay (talk) 08:14, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

It'd be better to add refs to the ones needing one. — Rlevse • Talk • 11:07, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
But that never happens. Despite the tag stating that unreferenced material may be removed. That's what I have done in this case based on the opinions expressed in the chat and a bit of WP:BOLD! --TimTay (talk) 11:25, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
You could have been BOLD by googling refs or looking in their wiki articles for refs, usually you find a good ref and can keep the item in the list. — Rlevse • Talk • 11:29, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Unreferenced entries have been moved to a talk subpage for further work. See the todo above. I guess we now need to delete the now-unused reference for the 30 or so astronauts that have been removed. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) talk - 11:52, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

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