Talk:Casla

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Redirecting from "Casla" to "Costelloe" is like redirecting from "Dún Laoghaire" to Kingstown. This must be corrected immediately.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.18.174.228 (talk) 20:16, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

Costelloe

The correct anglicised name is not Costello, but Costelloe, the previous official name until 2003. See the new topic below.

But the article "Casla" should at least mention that the English version of the name is "Costelloe" or "Costello". Not only is this the English and not the Gaelic Wikipedia (surely a powerful argument in itself per WP:TIES): ignoring the name "Costello" is an insult to the fine novel The Wind Changes by Olivia Manning, set among the Irish independence fighters in 1921, where Riordan, the last of the Easter Week leaders, is to land at Costello pier. Deipnosophista (talk) 18:58, 24 September 2015 (UTC)

I have made this change. Deipnosophista (talk) 12:36, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

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Casla does NOT mean Costelloe in Irish. Mac Oisdealbh, MacGoisdealbh, MacGoisdelbh are all accepted versions of the name Costelloe. Most who spell Costelloe with a E are from Galway, the rest spell it without the e on the end. (The small village called Casla in Connemara is actually the lodge where the owner of the White Star Lines , Bruce Ismay, builder of the Titanic, retired to after the ship went down. He hid in obscurity due to his jumping into the last lifeboat, and the repercussions of doing so. He had ordered only 20 lifeboats for the ship, saying the Titanic itslef was a lifeboat.) Casla means Castle in Irish, and may be part of the reason the MacGoisdealbhs became Costello, as this family, originally from Angle in Pembrokeshire, were actually castle builders for the de Lacys, who were the fist Irish Justiciars after the 1169 Cambro Norman invasion.

These are the earliest Annals mentioning the De Angulos as the Mac Costelloes, none of the legal docs prior to these entries call the De Angulos by their future Irish name, MacCoisdealbh. Nangle and Nagle are used for the side of the family that descend from the Patriarch, Gosylin( Jocelyn. Gauslin, ) MacCostelloe is used by the first Gilbert, son of Jocelyn, son of Gilbert of the Angle, Pembrokeshire. He built the first Norman structure, a Motte and Bailey, in 1192 in Rathgorgin, Galway, the western side of his land grant in Connacht. The plan, cross section and layout including filling the motte with a stream is the exact same as the original Castle or Tower House in Pembrokeshire. H Walton u C Dublin, 1980. Gilbert Mor, built Cael Uisce near Ballyshannon on Donegal, and was killed there in 1212. His son Gilbert Og carried on the Castle building and consolidating the lands granted by Cathal Crovderg , King of Connacht, to his father Gilbert Mor, in Maenmagh in East Galway, and confirmed by King John of Magna carta fame in 1207. More legal docs and names summarised by, as follows:

• Angulo, Angle, Gilbert de, pages 107, 110, 311, 353, 354, 359, 363.
• Philip De- 359, 529, 630, 656.
• William De- 363, 496, 673.
• Wallter De- 619- 1b

Most of these are witness lists from the 1170 to 1200's, with the most prominent other Normans in Ireland at the time, including the famous John de Courcy, Raymond le Gross, and John Marshall, all of whom were also from Pembrokeshire and Wales. MacOisdealbh (talk) 19:01, 20 September 2021 (UTC) Pedigree from the Journal of Ulster Archeology on JSTOR, Article called Vassals of the Earl of Ulster.

References

Hostilo as MacCostelloe patriarch completly bogus

My post from last year has a boxed paragraph still promoting the erroneous split of the De Angulo family into Nagle Nangle clans and MacGoisdealbh/ MacCostelloe clan with their sub clans of Waldron MacJordan and MacPhilib. The Sweetman footnotes alone prove no such Hostilo ever existed, at all. The later Cottonian, Ware and Carew manuscripts early 1630’s to 1680’s pushed this variation of the MacCostelloe family pedigree to separate their fellow Lords of Navan at that time. These Nangles were Barons Navan and founded the town of Navan and re built the st Mary’s Abbey there as well. The attempt to disassociate with the MacCostelloes was partly due to Cromwell’s adventures while in Ireland, as well as the coming penal laws during the middle to late 1600’s. Also, the famous Raparee, Dudley Mac Costelloe was well known at that time, and the Nangles were not interested in any family connection with this famous “Scourge of Old Mayo.”1667. The lament for Dudley MacCostelloe : No more will Baralyre wood,

Hear thru it’s dale and glade, 

the echo of the Colonels voice,

nor fear his Toledo Blade, 

from ancient Mask to regal Erne , where with Nangle he roamed wide, to rob the rich, and help the poor, and stem the crimson tide, so rest in peace bold swordsman, though no stone marks your grave,

for on  the gibbet  you were hung,
Spiked by an Ormond knave, 

but tonight around ruined Castlemore, a Connacht wind will blow, for to praise the name of the man they called, the Scourge of Old Mayo” 2607:FEA8:1220:1900:F8E3:5DC1:CBBB:EE86 (talk) 03:28, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

Here is the real skinny

The correct anglicised name is not Costello, but Costelloe, the previous official name until 2003. Those of us who spell our name with an E are NOT Normans, as proved by YDNA analysis our marker M269 Marker is DF63, and we are unrelated to any Norman family, instead being an ancient sept predating, and not descended from, either Naill of the Nine Hostages (DF13) nor Milesians. McLysaght the Englishman got it wrong, I have spent 30 years researching this. The DNA proves that we are one of the most ancient families in Ireland. Casla is the modern Irish equivalent of the ancient word gCaisle, meaning the People of the Sea. DNA proves we are descended from Phoenicians who arrived in Cornwall 4000 years ago for the tin mines and set up the first Irish port at "Nangata", assumed to be in Sligo, but more likely Galway. The modern word Casla is cognate with this as an inlet from the sea, a harbour, our people are the gCais Le (gCaisle) the nation of the sea. We adopted the E to signify this when we got anglicised. Please try not to eradicate this important link in Irish history with a misunderstanding sourced in an academic error from an Hibernophile who lumped together families for convenience, in typical anglocentric black and white fashion. Any who wish to talk to me about this please timcostelloe at g mail I have 30 years of research and 4000 years of family history to draw on, as my aunty (who married into our family) was fond to say, "The Costelloe's in Ireland are as old as the stones." Listening to Raidio Na Gaeltachta as I write this. The Norman angle is a red herring. We believe our ancestor to be Manannan, son of Lir. §§ https://www.logainm.ie/ga/130954 I could log in but I never do. Get in touch. 49.224.227.75 (talk) 19:42, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

You may also like to visit Loch na gCaisle in Connemara. I’m sure you are all familiar with the tragedy of the Children of Lir, and the legends of Manannan MacLir. Leave our name alone, we are NOT Anglo-Normans. 49.224.227.75 (talk) 15:19, 25 November 2024 (UTC)

Loch na gCaisle – ar an mBóthar Buí, trasna ó Tigh Lamb, an t-ealaíontóir. Tagann an t-ainm ó ‘caislín’, éan beag breac a dhéanann a nead faoi chloch agus a bhíonn le feiceáil in aice na locha; nó an chiall eile atá ag ‘caislín’ is ea sruth beag; nó tá sé sa seanchas go raibh daoine ina gcónaí san áit a raibh ‘Caisle’ mar ainm orthu. Tá uaigheanna ó aimsir an ghorta ó dheas i bPoll na nGabhar.

Foinsí:

Logainmneacha agus Patrún Lonnaíochta ar an gCeathrú Rua, Eileen Nic Dhonncha 49.224.227.75 (talk) 15:34, 25 November 2024 (UTC)