Talk:MS-13: Difference between revisions

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Browse history interactively
← Previous editNext edit →
Content deleted Content added
VisualWikitext
m File(s) used on this page are up for deletion
Line 351: Line 351:
* [[commons:File:MaraSalvatruchaLocation.png|MaraSalvatruchaLocation.png]]<!-- COMMONSBOT: discussion | 2018-07-01T19:06:24.210790 | MaraSalvatruchaLocation.png -->
* [[commons:File:MaraSalvatruchaLocation.png|MaraSalvatruchaLocation.png]]<!-- COMMONSBOT: discussion | 2018-07-01T19:06:24.210790 | MaraSalvatruchaLocation.png -->
Participate in the deletion discussion at the [[commons:Commons:Deletion requests/File:MaraSalvatruchaLocation.png|nomination page]]. [[User:Community Tech bot|Community Tech bot]] ([[User talk:Community Tech bot|talk]]) 19:06, 1 July 2018 (UTC)
Participate in the deletion discussion at the [[commons:Commons:Deletion requests/File:MaraSalvatruchaLocation.png|nomination page]]. [[User:Community Tech bot|Community Tech bot]] ([[User talk:Community Tech bot|talk]]) 19:06, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

== The article should cover Trump's MS-13 rhetoric ==

One of the primary reasons why people know about this organization and check on this article is due to the rhetoric of Pres Trump. The organization clearly plays a major role in his anti-immigration rhetoric, with Trump concocting a number of falsehoods about the organization and Democrats' alleged support for the organization. The Wikipedia article should cover Trump's rhetoric about MS-13, and outline all the falsehoods that are out there in public discourse as a result of the Trump's rhetoric. [[User:Snooganssnoogans|Snooganssnoogans]] ([[User talk:Snooganssnoogans|talk]]) 18:23, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

Revision as of 18:23, 10 July 2018

Edit request on 2 April 2012

Please remove footnote # 37. ^ http://wn.com/New_Haven_CT_Vietnam_Veterans_Memorial_Hit_AGAIN_MS-13_gang


Skywink (talk) 13:56, 2 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: Why? Celestra (talk) 15:02, 2 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Spread to Europe

In April 2012 the first reports of MS13 gangs active in s'Hertogenbosch came in.

Reports state that groups of children and young adults, some kids as young as 12, getting MS13 tatoos and displaying extremely violent behaviour. The rituals they are reported to perform are also exactly the same as those in Los Angeles, or anywhere else MS13 is active.

[1] [2] — Preceding unsigned comment added by Deuzige (talk • contribs) 21:57, 11 April 2012

References

  1. ^ http://www.hartvannederland.nl/nederland/noord-brabant/2012/bendegedrag-op-bossche-basisschool/
  2. ^ http://www.nu.nl/binnenland/2784441/bossche-basisscholieren-vertonen-bendegedrag.html

Misspellings

Many throughout — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.82.247.37 (talk) 12:42, 16 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Maras as political actors

Here's a good ref from InSight Crime. It could serve the article quite well. [1] ComputerJA (talk) 04:32, 30 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved. Jenks24 (talk) 14:01, 14 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]


Mara Salvatrucha → MS-13 – Per WP:COMMONNAME. A bit over a million Google hits for "Mara Salvatrucha" -wikipedia. 364 million for MS-13 -wikipedia. I don't think the official name does much good here when the gang is commonly known as MS-13. --BDD (talk) 23:53, 2 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

  • re-direct MS-13 here, but the the name change doesn't seem needed. Niteshift36 (talk) 00:16, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Support. I agree with BDD. We can bend the rules this time and allow the change. I don't feel strongly towards keeping the name or moving it, but you have my support. ComputerJA (talk) 03:25, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

  • Since MS-13 now redirects here, do we need to bend the rules? People searching for either term will end up here. Niteshift36 (talk) 12:54, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Yeah, you're right. I noticed that the move was made once I had posted. Thanks. ComputerJA (talk) 13:15, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Which rules, exactly, would we be bending? --BDD (talk) 15:20, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Does it really matter? Both terms bring them here at this point. Leaving it as the existing (and actual name) presents no problem at all. So why are we intent on "fixing" something that isn't broken? Niteshift36 (talk) 16:43, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • That's just what we do. Do you disagree with this move, for example? --BDD (talk) 17:06, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • "That's just what we do"? That is hardly a persuasive reason. As for your example....wow, could you find something any less on-point? The current title here is not some acronym that nobody understands. It's a fairly common use. I understand that you have some affection for the WP:COMMONNAME guideline but that doesn't mean everything needs "fixed". Again, you've given no real reason to change something that isn't broken to something that already leads here except "cause we do". Niteshift36 (talk) 18:18, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ok, I can be more formal. The nutshell summary of WP:AT: "Article titles should be recognizable to readers, unambiguous, and consistent with usage in reliable English-language sources." The Google hits certainly suggest that MS-13 is predominant in reliable English-language sources. More formal analyses may use the gang's full name, but the same could be said about the established WP:COMMONNAME examples, such as Bill Clinton, heroin, caffeine, and Nazi Party. Mara Salvatrucha is an official name, which is not the best choice for an article title when common alternatives are available. You may be very familiar with that official name—I see you're interested in (serving in?) law enforcement, so that makes sense. But plenty of other people are just going to hear about MS-13 on the news and may never hear the full name. I only encountered the full name during the course of some research. You may not like the Fort Dix example, but it's apt. People familiar with the US military may know what JB MDL Dix is, but most people just hear "Fort Dix." "Fort Dix" existed as a redirect to JB MDL Dix before that requested move; the existence of redirects is a poor reason to ignore the WP:COMMONNAME policy. --BDD (talk) 19:39, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Nice try. Cutting and pasting a large about of a policy I've already read doesn't really further your cause. I know you have a huge affection for that policy but your argument boils down to "because it is there". While the Ghits may be a bigger number, bigger numbers aren't what drives everything. Mara Salvatrucha is NOT an uncommon term. Well over a million Ghits proves that. It is not ambiguous. In fact, there would be no other "mara salvatrucha". There are, however, other uses of MS-13. It is consistant with use in reliable sources. So there really isn't a prblem with COMMONNAME at all.Since typing MS-13 in the box will lead you here, any fears of people not finding it because it isn't "common" enough are unfounded. And no, the Ft. Dix example really isn't that relevant. We are back to you insistig that we fix something that really isn't broken and the reason is "because it's there". Sorry, ain't buying it. Niteshift36 (talk) 01:01, 4 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support The arguments posted above have convinced me that MS-13 is the best title, and I'm not dissuaded by the argument that MS-13 already redirects here so it doesn't matter anyway. Theoldsparkle (talk) 14:12, 12 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Editrequest

Please add

"MS13" redirects here. For other uses, see MS 13.

{{redirect|MS13|other uses|MS 13}}

to the top of the page. --70.49.127.65 (talk) 02:58, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

 Done [2] Thank you. Rjd0060 (talk) 03:16, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Etymology Numbers

The letter 13 represents the number of men each member has slept with. Joining this gang requires you to sleep with at least 5 men of higher ranks. MS also stands for "must suck". Perhaps the 13 part of the name may be derived from another gang, in Venice, V13 (not Italy). Other nearby gangs, subsequently use same number - Santa Monica 13, Culver City 13. Venice 13 was the postal Zone prior to USPS zip codes (90013) or zip+4. 144.183.224.2 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 23:39, 11 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Edit request on 12 October 2012

Please change "...mistakened for a member of the Bloods gang." to "...mistaken for a member of the Bloods gang." Mistakened is not a form of mistaken. Drtocto (talk) 15:19, 12 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

M16 "high powered assault rifle'

No-one in their right mind would say an M-16is a "high powered" rifle. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.213.82.212 (talk) 01:52, 29 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  • Except for the reliable source that is being cited. Niteshift36 (talk) 02:02, 29 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • so we have to change all of widespread knowledge because one guy wrote an article? if there were an article that a smart car was a huge truck, is it now a huge truck?--Mapsfly (talk) 13:54, 31 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Where does this membership number come from?

  • The information card states that the membership of this gang is up to 70,000. It would be nice to have a source to corroborate this statement.
  • The article states that the FBI estimates their number between 30,000 and 50,000. (Source)
  • Shall we correct the number in the card? Any current information about this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kikeh (talk • contribs) 10:24, 22 May 2015

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 2 external links on MS-13. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 12:31, 24 January 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Major Crimes

The In Film section should be switched to In Film and Television and include the Major Crimes episode Target of Opportunity where MS-13 were the main suspects in the killing of two police officers.--32.214.195.155 (talk) 05:52, 27 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Europe/Spain?

Is there any evidence for MS-13 in Spain or Europe? Please put it in the article — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:810D:9CC0:25AC:85B0:94DA:5D3B:8994 (talk) 07:45, 8 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

13 seconds to join

I think it should be mentioned in the article that the reason why there's a 13 in MS-13 is because it takes 13 seconds of getting beaten in order to join the said gang.[1][2][3][4][5][6] 108.45.29.72 (talk) 02:57, 30 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ "Inside MS-13's secret initiation rituals and internal feuds". Boston.com. 2016-04-21. Retrieved 2016-09-30.
  2. ^ "MS-13 gang members convicted by S.F. jury - SFGate". SFGate. 2011-08-30. Retrieved 2016-09-30.
  3. ^ "Montreal MP Probes the Sub-Culture of Gangs in Canada - Americas Quarterly". Americas Quarterly. 2009-11-12. Retrieved 2016-09-30.
  4. ^ "Exploitation of Border Security by MS-13 in Aiding Al Qaeda's Agenda for ... - Google Books". Google Books. 2007. Retrieved 2016-09-30.
  5. ^ "9 MS-13 members held in police raids - Washington Times". The Washington Times. 2005-08-25. Retrieved 2016-09-30.
  6. ^ "The Fight Against MS-13 - CBS News". CBS News. 2005-12-01. Retrieved 2016-09-30.
Thank you. I was about to leave a note inquiring as to why under the etymology section the “13” part of the name isn’t addressed. Your answer not only addresses this but is replete with references. So why haven't you or anyone added this yet? As to why I don’t, it’s because adding references is not my forte. I’m rather a tech klutz, unfortunately. Please by all means add this. Great work! Thank you.HistoryBuff14 (talk) 15:14, 30 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 16 May 2017

I would like to add information about the more recent sanctions imposed by the United States on the three imprisoned leaders of MS-13 (José Luís Mendoza Figueroa, Eduardo Erazo Nolasco, and Élmer Canales Rivera). While these men are in prison in El Salvador, they continue to give orders. As a result the United States Department of Treasury has places further sanctions than those created in 2012. In 2015, the United States claimed the Department of Treasury would seize all assets controlled by these men and any business with these assets would no longer be allowed.

[1] [2]

These changes differ from those made in 2012 (linked bellow) in that these most recent sanctions name the names of the leaders of Mara Salvatrucha and also creates clear guidelines for violations of the sanctions.

[3]

In addition to these proposed changes, I would like to add that the current President of the United States has made at the most recent NRA meeting. He has said, " For too long, Washington has gone after law-abiding gun owners while making life easier for criminals, drug dealers, traffickers and gang members. MS-13?" [4] This quote suggests some government action coming from the United States but none has been passed. Tcramer70 (talk) 18:49, 16 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ https://www.treasury.gov/press-center/press-releases/Pages/jl10026.aspx
  2. ^ https://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/17/world/americas/us-imposes-sanctions-on-3-leaders-of-gang-based-in-el-salvador.html?_r=0
  3. ^ https://www.treasury.gov/press-center/press-releases/Pages/tg1733.aspx
  4. ^ https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2017/04/28/remarks-president-trump-national-rifle-association-leadership-forum
The citation to the NYT will probably be sufficient for the prior statement, but the rest of that is either primary or speculation. --Izno (talk) 12:57, 31 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Partly done: First statement added, second statement is WP:SYNTH. – Train2104 (t • c) 02:51, 7 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 5 external links on MS-13. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 00:31, 29 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Ms "13"

The "13" comes from the letter "m" being the thirteenth letter in the alphabet. That is where the thirteen seconds comes from Hbomb609 (talk) 05:19, 22 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 26 July 2017

Under "Publicized Crimes" it reads, "In June 2017, Darwin Martinez Torres murdered 17-year old Nabra Hassanen." -- there's conflicting reports about Torres' involvement with MS-13. And the only evidence supporting that he was comes from an anonymous woman that filed a police report for sexual assault identified him as such. He's an awful, contemptible human being, but it is unclear if he's actually part of MS13. 113.161.71.157 (talk) 08:30, 26 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Done I removed per WP:NOTNEWS and WP:BLPCRIME. Martinez Torres is not convicted of the crime and we can't say that he either murdered the victim or that he is a member of the gang based on the citation given. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 14:17, 26 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 27 July 2017

Just a FYI.....MS13 started in El Salvador, Guatemala and Nicaragua. The gang started with El Salvadorian refugees. 75.144.229.1 (talk) 21:52, 27 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. JTP (talk • contribs) 22:01, 27 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 30 July 2017

The final two paragraphs in the section called 'Charlotte, North Carolina Cases" includes an extremely atypical, inordinate, highly unnecesssary and excessive identification of individuals involved in the investigation and prosecution of the case and even those who simply made comments on the government's press release. The detail is highly unusual and needlessly points to potential targets for retribution. 173.239.228.100 (talk) 05:50, 30 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. I would say "please establish a consensus" and ask that you go to the user who added this information, but I'm also confused as to whether this should be changed or removed entirely. jd22292 (Jalen D. Folf) (talk) 19:20, 30 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Archives Search results

Xb2u7Zjzc32 (talk) 10:51, 10 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Edit request 8/16/2017

Under Physical Appearance is a sentence about unaccompanied minors. This information does not fit into the subhead / paragraph. If kept it should go elsewhere. The reference I cite below for that allegation (school districts refusing to admit them) is far better:

[1]

References

  1. ^ http://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/learning-the-language/2016/05/report_access_to_education_blo.html

Semi-protected edit request on 8 October 2017

Manuelmsd (talk) 04:25, 8 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

marabunta, the name of a fierce type of ant. Correction: marabunta, is a massive migration of voracious amazonian ants that attack the vegetation and all kinds of animals

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. SparklingPessimist Scream at me! 20:28, 8 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 19 November 2017

change in Membership "70,000" to "70,000 in Central America" 2.152.165.203 (talk) 19:53, 19 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

source (under Geography it says the US Southern Command says there are as many as 70,000 gang members in the Northern Triangle [Guatemala, Honduras, El Salvador] : http://www.insightcrime.org/el-salvador-organized-crime-news/mara-salvatrucha-ms-13-profile — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.152.165.203 (talk) 19:58, 19 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: I think it's fine as it is. —MRD2014 Talk • Edits • Help! 22:25, 20 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 4 December 2017

Change:

Illegal immigration and human smuggling

According to The Washington Times, MS-13 "is thought to have established a major smuggling center" in Mexico.[1] There were reports by the Minuteman Project that MS members were ordered to Arizona to target U.S. Border Patrol agents and Minuteman Project volunteers.[2]

Robert Morales, a prosecutor for Guatemala, indicated to The Globe and Mail that some Central American gang members seek refugee status in Canada. Superintendent of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police integrated gang task force, John Robin, said in an interview that "I think [gang members] have a feeling that police here won't treat them in the harsh manner they get down there."[3] Robin noted that Canadian authorities "want to avoid ending up like the U.S., which is dealing with the problem of Central American gangsters on a much bigger scale".[3]

The gang is violent to migrants on the southern border of Mexico.[4]

To:

Illegal immigration and human smuggling

According to The Washington Times, MS-13 "is thought to have established a major smuggling center" in Mexico.[5] There were reports by the Minuteman Project that MS members were ordered to Arizona to target U.S. Border Patrol agents and Minuteman Project volunteers.[6]

Robert Morales, a prosecutor for Guatemala, indicated to The Globe and Mail that some Central American gang members seek refugee status in Canada. Superintendent of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police integrated gang task force, John Robin, said in an interview that "I think [gang members] have a feeling that police here won't treat them in the harsh manner they get down there."[3] Robin noted that Canadian authorities "want to avoid ending up like the U.S., which is dealing with the problem of Central American gangsters on a much bigger scale".[3]

The gang is violent to migrants on the southern border of Mexico.[7]

A diaspora is a group of people who are united by ethnic or cultural ties. It is a branch of transnationalism, which is a group of ideas coming from outside different nations or countries. A diaspora “is not a discrete entity, but rather it is a combination of contradictory convergences of people, ideas, and their cultural considerations”. [8]

According to Danielle Renwick, tens of thousands of refugees from The Northern Triangle ( Salvadorans, Guatemalans and Hondurans) came to the U.S seeking asylum from their violence ridden countries, many of them with children. Those countries that belong to the Northern Triangle were in the midst of civil wars in the 1980s.[9]

Since their migration from the 1980s, MS 13 grew in power in the United States during the 1990s. At this time, towards the end of Clinton’s Presidency, the U.S. intervened to get these foreign individuals out of the country. To do so, foreign born residents that had varying criminal records were deported back to their homelands. The U.S. deportation policy were at an all time high, thereafter starting the trend of MS 13 influx to and from the U.S. and El Salvador.[10]

The strict deportation policies created to target MS 13 and other gangs like M 18, created a “Revolving Door migratory pattern.” (1) The migration of MS 13 from Central America to the U.S., and being deported from the U.S. back to Central America, created an ideology that was strengthened throughout that migratory pattern. This was possible because people who fled Central America were able to come together as a group and adapt to a new way of life in the U.S. This brought about their knowledge and involvement in extortion, kidnapping, turf protection, human trafficking, and illegal drug marketing. These ideas were brought back and forth through the “revolving doors,” and they consistently found ways to improve in these areas. This was the start of their diaspora and became a source of great concern.[11]

According to Paul Liquorie, “We have seen time and time again people who have been deported returning back to the United States because they are already networked into the criminal element that is running the human smuggling routes.”[12] Operez93 (talk) 03:12, 4 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ "Al Qaeda seeks tie to local gangs". Washington Times. The Washington Times, LLC. September 28, 2004.
  2. ^ "Gang will target Minuteman vigil on Mexico border". Washtimes.com. March 28, 2005.
  3. ^ a b c d Mason, Gary (January 7, 2008). "Canada is a haven to gangsters on the run". The Globe and Mail. Retrieved January 7, 2008.
  4. ^ Feldman, Megan (July 26, 2007). "El Tren de la Muerte (the Death Train)". Dallas Observer. Retrieved July 27, 2007.
  5. ^ "Al Qaeda seeks tie to local gangs". Washington Times. The Washington Times, LLC. September 28, 2004.
  6. ^ "Gang will target Minuteman vigil on Mexico border". Washtimes.com. March 28, 2005.
  7. ^ Feldman, Megan (July 26, 2007). "El Tren de la Muerte (the Death Train)". Dallas Observer. Retrieved July 27, 2007.
  8. ^ Quayson, Ato (2013). A Companion to Diaspora and Transnationalism. New York: Wiley Blackwell.
  9. ^ Renwick, Danielle. "Central America's Violent Northern Triangle". CFR.org. Retrieved 16 January 2016.
  10. ^ "MS 13". InSight Crime. Retrieved 9 March 2017.
  11. ^ Franco, Celinda. "The MS-13 and 18th Street Gangs: Emerging Transnational Gang Threats" (PDF). FAS.org. Retrieved 30 January 2008.
  12. ^ Dorer, Kiyo. "MS-13: The Rise of a Deadly Gang in US Suburbia". dw.com. Retrieved 9 February 2017.
@Operez93:  Not done. Two things.
  1. Why do you think the article needs this change?
  2. I don't know if this is the rule but the tendency is to avoid making truly large edits via these requests. The idea is, you can edit this article. Just not yet. Once your account is four days old and you've edited ten times from it, you'll no longer be restrained by semi-protection. You created this account a few weeks ago and you're at three edits. Would you mind finding a less controversial article and contributing to it? That way, you learn through experience what to do, what not to do, how things work, and so on. Once you've got more edits, you can come back here with a little more know-how and you won't need to go through this process. CityOfSilver 03:21, 4 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I believe that this edit makes this article stronger. I could add a subcategory if that is better? I am doing this as a school final project that's why I have chosen this page. I understand the the topic is controversial but what is being said, I do not believe is controversial. (Operez93 (talk) 00:30, 6 December 2017 (UTC))[reply]

Seems you have more than 10 edits and 4-day account. You should be able to edit the article no. If you still can't, ask to be confirmed at WP:PERM/C. And know that any controversial changes may be reverted, and you have discuss its relevance and verifiability before restoring. –Ammarpad (talk) 13:34, 7 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]


Sanctions

267 arrests Nov 16, 2017

I suggest to add a paragraph about the significant mass arrests event. With a total of 267 alleged MS-13 gang members and associates arrested. This was confirmed by the DOJ, DHS, ICE. How about the draft paragraph below?

On November 16, 2017 the U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS), U.S. Department of Justice (DOJ), and Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), officials announced that they arrested a total of 267 alleged MS-13 gang members and associates in Operation Raging Bull. Which was carried out in two phases. The first phase was in September 2017, and resulted in 53 arrests in El Salvador. The second phases was between October 8 and November 11, 2017, and resulted in 214 arrests in the U.S. Charges include but are not limited to engaging in drug trafficking, child prostitution, human smuggling, racketing, conspiracy to commit murder. According to Attorney General Jeff Sessions, "These 267 arrests are the next step toward making this country safer by taking MS-13 off of our streets for good".[1][2][3][4]

Francewhoa (talk) 05:04, 8 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ "22 MS-13 Members and Associates Charged Federally in ICE's MS-13 Targeted 'Operation Raging Bull' Which Netted a Total of 267 Arrests". United States Department of Justice. 2017-11-16. Retrieved 2018-01-08. {{cite web}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |dead-url= (help)
  2. ^ "Operation Raging Bull". Department of Homeland Security. Retrieved 2018-01-08. {{cite web}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |dead-url= (help)
  3. ^ McCausland, Phil (2017-11-16). "Federal government announces hundreds of arrests in MS-13 crackdown". NBC News. Retrieved 2018-01-08. {{cite news}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |dead-url= (help)
  4. ^ "More than 250 'MS-13 gang members' arrested in six-week crackdown". Daily Mail Online. 2017-11-16. Retrieved 2018-01-08. {{cite news}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |dead-url= (help)

Please correct.

Reads as follows;

On 13/14 of August 2017, MS-13 New Jersey faction member Walter Yovany Gomez and who was added to the FBI most wanted list in April 2017,[63] was apprehended and charged with the 2011 brutal murder of his friend Julio Matute for associating with another gang.

Should read as follows;

On 13/14 of August 2017, MS-13 New Jersey faction member Walter Yovany Gomez, who was added to the FBI most wanted list in April 2017,[63] was apprehended and charged with the 2011 brutal murder of his friend Julio Matute for associating with another gang. Cbailey505 (talk) 14:29, 25 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

 Done @Cbailey505:. –Ammarpad (talk) 20:06, 25 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you Cbailey505 (talk) 00:34, 26 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Please update membership number

Since this is an American gang that has become transnational, please update the membership numbers under the “Quick facts” section to reflect the 8,000 - 10,000 members in the US and 30,000 - 50,000 worldwide. The 70,000 number currently listed is misleading. The source would be the same fbi.gov link used under the History section, #28. TruePatriot82 (talk) 22:09, 1 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Not human but violent animals.

I would suggest marking this with "weasel words." Humans are animals, being referred to as a violent animal does not remove status as a species or negate being a human. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 143.85.169.29 (talk) 20:45, 21 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed, the cited statement doesn't assert that they aren't human, only that they are animals. 72.48.20.137 (talk) 21:51, 21 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 22 May 2018

The United States Government has not called the gang members "animals." That name was applied only by a May, 2018 statement from the White House. The White House, thankfully, is NOT the same as the United States Government. The statement should be changed to show that the name came from the White House. Only then will it be accurate. 2601:244:C100:725C:DDCF:E7E1:22C2:9013 (talk) 18:40, 22 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

 Done The source itself makes it clear that this is an Administration political statement and the White House is, at the very most, the leadership organ for one-third of the "United States Government" Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 18:58, 22 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Map of MS-13 presence

This map: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:MaraSalvatruchaLocation.png

1 - It is a user created, unsourced (four are dead links, one is in a foreign language) work. 2 - There are no numbers or percentages used to describe the amount of gang members. What amount of MS-13 members qualifies as a "light" or "heavy" presence? What is the minimum number to have a "lighter presence?" Where is the threshold between "lighter presence" and "heavy presence"? 3 - What determines presence? Frequency of incidents? Number of identified members?

I suggest either providing context to what "lighter" and "heavy" presence mean, or remove the map entirely, for it is misleading. Thank you. 2604:2000:C693:DA00:68B8:B0DE:246A:59E4 (talk) 20:12, 3 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I'm requesting an edit for image in article.

I'm requesting an edit to the image that shows the "prominent and less prominent" areas where the gang is concentrated. There are no maras in nicaragua. The amount is miniscule to non-existent. If that means Nicaragua is "less prominent" area, then Costa Rica should be shaded, as well as Panama and Belize. There are also no citations for the maras in either of the 4 countries I noted, so please make revisions to the image. 108.185.22.229 (talk) 17:50, 1 July 2018 (UTC) 7/1/18[reply]

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. Community Tech bot (talk) 19:06, 1 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The article should cover Trump's MS-13 rhetoric

One of the primary reasons why people know about this organization and check on this article is due to the rhetoric of Pres Trump. The organization clearly plays a major role in his anti-immigration rhetoric, with Trump concocting a number of falsehoods about the organization and Democrats' alleged support for the organization. The Wikipedia article should cover Trump's rhetoric about MS-13, and outline all the falsehoods that are out there in public discourse as a result of the Trump's rhetoric. Snooganssnoogans (talk) 18:23, 10 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:MS-13&oldid=849695366"