Talk:Twitter

Changing the lead sentence.

The lead sentence should be: “Twitter, officially known as X since July 2023.” Instead of “X commonly referred by its former name, Twitter.” It’s just better wording, and it saves some time reading. + the article name is “Twitter.” So start it with Twitter & not X because people might not know what that means. And then add “officially known as X since July 2023.” To let people name it started out as Twitter then became X in July 2023. Therefore spreading more information. So my version of the lead sentence makes more sense. TheMasterMind321 (talk) 20:32, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

I would agree, but there is hidden text saying Please do not alter this wording. Is there a consensus for this wording, or was it added unilaterally? BilledMammal (talk) 02:08, 10 May 2024 (UTC)

The wording was shaped by multiple editors over the course of several months. The hidden note was added because drive-by editors would arbitrarily change the wording every few days, which led to edit wars and instability. I don't think any wording is necessarily "better" than others (there are probably a million different combinations we can use), but there is WP:IMPLICITCONSENSUS for the current wording. If editors desire a formal discussion to reach formal consensus on a wording, I wouldn't be opposed. InfiniteNexus (talk) 00:57, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

The current version was authored by @Unknown0124 in February 2024. Before that, it changed many times (formerly and commonly, colloquially, formerly known as, formerly called, currently rebranding to X, etc.) Again, I don't really have a preference for which wording, but I do think we should pick one and stick to it. InfiniteNexus (talk) 01:07, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

This current wording directly contradicts MOS:LEADSENTENCE: "the page title should be the subject of the first sentence." Edited to conform to the guideline. 162 etc. (talk) 04:02, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

honestly i think the entire page's name should be changed to X. The company's name isn't even Twitter anymore. Frozen902 (talk) 17:33, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

this wording is here because of politics and it's massively non partisan. this whole page is busted to shit LOL

trash 2604:3D08:357F:7300:9124:407A:A056:5BFA (talk) 01:42, 30 June 2024 (UTC)

i meant partisan

^*Farts* 2604:3D08:357F:7300:9124:407A:A056:5BFA (talk) 01:42, 30 June 2024 (UTC)

It should stay as it is. The excuse 'Nobody knows what X is' does not work anymore. Almost everyone knows what X is by now. It would be more confusing to start with Twitter because it is not clear what is meant by that. Does it mean the platform before Elon, or before the name change, or the platform now? X solves all these problems.

To me, the article name should also have been changed to X by now, like the articles in many other languages, but that is another topic. Mstf221 (talk) 06:22, 5 July 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for opening this discussion. I disagree. I believe that the title of the article should be changed to "X (social networking platform)", and the lead sentence should read "X, formally known as Twitter...". Usually we change the article title when a company or service changes it's name, so why the reluctance to be accurate and updated here, too? Grammar crackers (talk) 03:37, 28 July 2024 (UTC)

I would keep most of the original wording but include "more" after "X." NesserWiki (talk) 09:06, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

Lead sentence part deux

(courtesy ping of @ScarletViolet:). While WP:ISATERMFOR could possibly apply here, the fact is that the social media service still remains, just been rebranded and with new management, and the goal of lede here is to be clear to the reader we are talking about the history and related factors of the service up until the July 2023, when it was known as Twitter. This isn't the type of word-game puffery that ISATERMFOR addresses. --Masem (t) 00:27, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

• adding, we need to be careful to use language like "Twitter was a social media service..." the service still exists, it's the Twitter branding and management that changed with the acquisition. Masem (t) 17:52, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

  I've once again changed the lead sentence to be compliant with MOS:LEADSENTENCE. Manual of Style is pretty clear on this. @Amakuru: 162 etc. (talk) 05:47, 16 August 2024 (UTC)

  I think it was probably better the way it was, with the "X, commonly known as Twitter..." formulation but not a hill I'm about to die on... It's fairly standard to use an official name first and then state the "common" name afterwards, for example ""The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, commonly known as the United Kingdom..." or ""Louis Burton Lindley Jr. (June 29, 1919 – December 8, 1983), better known by his stage name Slim Pickens..." As stated above, we probably ought to rename this page to X (social media network) or similar before too long, as all the conditions for WP:NAMECHANGES are met... Either way, hopefully we won't be reinserting the original research that X and Twitter are different things!  — Amakuru (talk) 08:13, 16 August 2024 (UTC)

Rfc on which word best describes this site's situation

There has been a bit of disagreement on which word should describe Twitter's situation (specifically in the first sentence and in the infobox) now that X is its own page.

1. Defunct
2. Rebranded to X
3. Replaced by X
4. Succeeded by X
5. Renamed to X (option was added later)
6. other

Unnamed anon (talk) 17:39, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

I think Option 2 or Option 5 would work best, perhaps worded “Rebranded as X” or “Renamed X” respectively. Vanesa2494 (talk) 22:19, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

As the nominator, I choose option 2. Twitter still exists and it never shut down, since all tweets, likes, accounts, etc. carried over into X, and the twitter.com URL still redirects to X.com, even when viewing specific tweets. The policy changes gathered enough sources for a split to be necessary, but it's not accurate to say Twitter is defunct or replaced when it still exists. Neutral on "succeeded" (option 4) though, since it doesn't as strongly imply that the site is gone as saying it is "defunct" or "replaced" does. Unnamed anon (talk) 17:44, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

@Unnamed anon X supports:

• Introduction of a paywall with different tiers; the following features may be under a paywall:1
  • Long-form text, including text formatting and article publishing
  • Audio and video calls
  • Long-form video uploads
  • Grok chatbot
  • X Pro
• Removal of features such as Circles, birthday balloons, nft profile pictures and pronouns.23
• Introduction of rate limiters.4
• Significant changes in the backend.^
• Removal of the legacy Twitter API, resulting in the shutdown of most third-party apps.56
• Changes to the recommendation algorithm.7

^Elon Musk initially recruited 50 of his best Tesla employees to analyze the code. According to him, the Twitter code was like a forest that he cleaned, but to what extent this was done is unknown due to a lack of sources. He also pulled the plug on one of the Twitter data centers during the process. The extent of resource cutting is unknown as well. My observation is that X runs on half the resources and code compared to Twitter, but I don't have reliable sources to prove that.89

Defunct implies that the entity was shut down, which doesn't fit. Rebrand means a change in name, logo, and managerial and organizational changes. But it doesn't include any functionality changes it underwent. So I choose either Replaced or Succeeded. However, I lack a concrete source to prove that Elon Musk has changed the entire code, which makes me choose Succeeded. But if someone proves that there was a major change in the back-end, it will be Rebrand.

Also if it's succeeded, what will be the short description of the article? Anoop Bhatia (talk) 20:17, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

I believe that this amounts to original research. We should align with how reliable sources describe the situation. HenryMP02 (talk) 07:15, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

@HenryMP02 Only the part about how much the backend changed is original research; the rest is written based on sources.Anoop Bhatia (talk) 15:05, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

• Comment — RfC participants might want to be aware that the decision to change this article's scope comes from a requested move on a different page and that closure is currently under review. Dylnuge ^{(Talk • Edits)} 01:04, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

  Huh, I was not aware that there was a move review going on. Should this RfC be closed until we know how to handle the scope of this and the X social network pages? Unnamed anon (talk) 01:27, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

  I'm not an expert but it strikes me as probably fine to discuss in tandem. Assuming the scope change is ultimately upheld, this discussion makes sense as-is, and assuming it's ultimately overturned, it's irrelevant anyways. That said, I thought I'd note it for anyone seeing this in RfC listings and wondering when/where/how the change originated. Plus it sends people with those concerns to the right place; another lengthy "how should the Twitter/X family of articles be organized" argument would certainly derail the intent of this RfC. Dylnuge ^{(Talk • Edits)} 01:40, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Option 2 makes the most sense to me. Twitter didn't go away. The company rebranded and is now called X. twitter.com and x.com are the same website. The separate article created for X when that article says it was a "rebrand" and "rename" too. Saucysalsa30 (talk) 02:53, 8 June 2024 (UTC)

Option 2. What to call the change from Twitter to X is a straightforward case, sourcing wise; the term "rebrand" is widely dominant across sources (e.g. [1], [2], [3], [4]). "Rename" (not an explicit option in the RFC) appears to be the second most common term (e.g. [5], [6])—this could be an acceptable alternative. "Replace" (option 3) seems to only be used in referring to specific elements of the rebrand, such as the URL or logo change (e.g. [7], [8]). I didn't find any sources using the terms "succeeded" to mean replaced or describing Twitter as "defunct". Dylnuge ^{(Talk • Edits)} 18:06, 8 June 2024 (UTC)

Option 2.{{SBB}} per logic and sources provided by Dylnuge. "Rename", though not an option is accurate and supported by use in sources. Pincrete (talk) 08:16, 9 June 2024 (UTC)

This cannot be fairly assessed without reference to the reliable sources. In fact may more than one term may fit though others are clearly wrong. Jorahm (talk) 19:09, 9 June 2024 (UTC)

I am observing that a common term is that the site was transformed but I also see that there are multiple ways to describe the relationship between X and Twitter and I don't think editors should be trying to summarize a complex change with a single word Jorahm (talk) 17:40, 23 June 2024 (UTC)

• Succeeded by X The platform underwent a regime change and experienced all the transformations that entails. The term for describing that is "succession". Reliable sources may not use that term, but in describing the transition from Twitter to X, they name changes which are so drastic that they match the concept of regime change much better than they do the concepts for renaming or rebranding. Wikipedia already has consensus that the situation is not at all typical for a rebranding because we have the unique editorial position of separately covering Twitter and X (social network). Because our scope of coverage is unique to us and because we already have consensus to separate the concepts, we should expect to have other differences in our presentation which account for our longer-term, deeper view of the platforms. We are not obligated to match our tone or word choice to daily news when we are telling the 20-year full story. "Rebrand" is not an accurate term in the context of that 20-year story. Bluerasberry (talk) 14:39, 10 June 2024 (UTC)

  Strongly agree. Twitter was transformed into something completely different as X. Rebrand doesn't begin to cover such a radical change. To lump them together in a single article is akin to if we did the same with, to use a random example, the Polish People's Republic and the modern Republic of Poland. Or corporate transitions like, to use another random example, British Aircraft Corporation to British Aerospace (which was a vastly less extreme change than than Twitter to X was). — Red XIV ^(talk) 13:16, 23 June 2024 (UTC)

  "radical change" is subjective. It's not like the functionality of Twitter suddenly became similar to that of MySpace. Instead of using WP:OR, let's follow what reliable sources say about this, and most say 'rebranded' (or 'renamed'). Some1 (talk) 15:11, 23 June 2024 (UTC)

• Option 2 That's the only correct option IMO. Twitter didn't go away, it just got rebranded to X after Musk acquired it. Some1 (talk) 23:19, 12 June 2024 (UTC)
• Option 2. We should probably also redo the RM to X (social network), as it seems per WP:NAMECHANGES the site is commonly called X now.  — Amakuru (talk) 11:42, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
• Option 2 (or 5). There's a reason why X is also called The Website Formerly Known As Twitter, at least in spirit. -BRAINULATOR9 (TALK) 13:18, 19 June 2024 (UTC)

Since the scope changes from last month were undone (meaning X (social network) is back to Twitter under Elon Musk), what should be done with this RfC? Would the consensus from this RfC just get logged here in case the scope changes are reinstated? Unnamed anon (talk) 19:09, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

The RfC doesn't change the scope of the article, only the way how the lead is phrased. Actually, it was changed since the move review. If and when the move is consensually made, then this article could change again its scope I believe. Web-julio (talk) 23:03, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

Disinformation and hate speech

The article says:

• Since his [Musk's] acquisition, the platform has been criticized for enabling the increased spread of disinformation and hate speech.

But the BBC says:

• Musk said his efforts to delete bots - automated accounts - has decreased misinformation on Twitter since his takeover.

and

"Do you see a rise of hate speech?" Mr Musk said. "I don't."

He asked our reporter James Clayton for specific examples of hateful content.

When he couldn't pinpoint individual messages, Mr Musk said: "You don't know what you're talking about… you just lied." [9]

I'm just wondering if we need a section in the article on "criticisms" or "controversy". --Uncle Ed (talk) 13:03, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

The BBC says "But there are both in-depth studies and anecdotal evidence that suggest hate speech has been growing under Mr Musk's tenure." Horse Eye's Back (talk) 14:05, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

The rise of hate speech, supported by those studies, as well as Musk's claim its not, absolutely needs mention, but that probably should be over at Twitter under Elon Musk. Masem (t) 17:42, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

I think it is already over at Twitter under Elon Musk and maybe also Views of Elon Musk? Not entirely sure what to do here, but a stand-alone "criticisms" or "controversy" section isn't it (even if those weren't in general discouraged) Horse Eye's Back (talk) 18:37, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

I agree that this makes sense to have covered in depth in the body and not just the lead (and probably not in a controversy section). If it's useful to any editors working on adding/expanding that, the lead used to have a bunch more sources, which I pared down in this diff. Dylnuge ^{(Talk • Edits)} 14:28, 3 July 2024 (UTC)

Would it be reasonable to reflect both names in the article title (e.g. Twitter/X)

Prefacing this by saying - I don't want to make this into a move request due to it being potentially disruptive. If there is support for this, I will open a "formal" move request.

I'm seeing it referred to as "X Platform" as well as twitter, or X (formerly twitter).

Both uses appear to be concurrent, so, would this not be a decent compromise? DarmaniLink (talk) 01:19, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

I think this should be moved to "X (social media)". Should have been done long time ago Leikstjórinn (talk) 15:57, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

It should be X (social network). X is its current official name, regardless of "how many people still call it Twitter". 2A00:23EE:1480:552D:6B93:11DB:E6A3:108C (talk) 16:15, 11 August 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia does not use "official names" . The relevant convention is Wikipedia:NCCORP. A search for recent news finds many articles still refer to the platform as Twitter, as do many users, and news anchors. Thorc12 (talk) 22:59, 11 August 2024 (UTC)

Agree to this statement given the Wikipedia:NCCORP page clearly states:

Whenever possible, the most common usage in independent, reliable, secondary sources should be used (such as The Hartford for The Hartford Financial Services Group, Inc.; and DuPont for E. I. du Pont de Nemours and Company).

While X is the official name, most people still refer to it as Twitter, or "X, previously known as Twitter". Not sure if there is a standard convention to use aka's....for example, Twitter (aka X)......or Twitter (now known as X). swinquest (talk) 21:08, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

I do rather like X (formerly known as Twitter) as a disambiguator vs. "X (social network)". That's the clear WP:COMMONNAME disambiguation/description being used by reliable sources such as the New York Times.

I'm unaware if there are any existing articles or conventions for using a disambiguation title like that. PK-WIKI (talk) PK-WIKI (talk) 21:17, 21 August 2024 (UTC)

Impressively, the phrase X formerly known as Twitter turns up About 5,920,000 results in a Google search. It's starting to feel like there's an argument to be made that that's the WP:COMMONNAME of the service now. FeRDNYC (talk) 09:35, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

I like this, it includes both names and avoids the issues caused by using either name exclusively. There is an argument to be made that it's too long, but, it is the name of the article and not the name of the service itself. DarmaniLink (talk) 03:00, 25 August 2024 (UTC)

Then again, X formerly Twitter? About 154,000,000 results. FeRDNYC (talk) 09:38, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Can you please address the potential compromise idea? really don't want this to devolve into the same rehashed arguments again, that would be extremely disruptive.

Both names and uses are concurrent in the news now, so it would seem reasonable to have a name to reflect both, right? DarmaniLink (talk) 07:19, 12 August 2024 (UTC)

But still, the offical name is X. It's just like how Mr. Pibb changed it's name to PibbExtra, but everybody still calls it Mr Pibb. It's about the officality of things, not how you want things to be. So i support this move request Leikstjórinn (talk) 21:01, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

I appreciate the effort, but I doubt that idea is going to get traction. It breaks the title guidelines, specifically on concision and naturalness (people are more likely to look for one or the other). Article titles aren't the end-all-be-all of the subject; we have redirects coming in from both names, and both names are mentioned in the first sentence. Dylnuge ^{(Talk • Edits)} 02:40, 16 August 2024 (UTC)

There is a current move request open at Twitter under Elon Musk seeking to move/rename that article to X (social network). In my opinion that's the easiest way forward; leave this article as "Twitter" representing the pre-Musk app, while "X (social network)" takes on the post-Musk evolution. PK-WIKI (talk) 21:13, 21 August 2024 (UTC)

That RM was finally closed today, as "no consensus". 162 etc. (talk) 18:24, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Requested move 25 August 2024

Twitter → X (social network) – Before reading this move request, the comments written on the move requests I opened on this article and Twitter under Elon Musk should be read. I am opening this move request for a second and final time given wbm1058's closure of the latter move request two days ago, which is well-articulated and notes that the AP Stylebook no longer requires "X, formerly known as Twitter", as mentioned by an editor here. The New York Times does not mention Twitter unless in reference to an action or statement made prior to July 2023. The strongest argument that opponents of a move have—that Twitter is the common name—is a difficult claim to substantiate, even with fallible Google Trends data. The page notice and WP:COMMONNAME defer to reliable sources. Efforts to move this article in the past were premature. In terms of the claim that the history and cultural impact of Twitter should bear weight, I note that Guaranteed Rate Field is named such, though many continue to refer to the South Side baseball field as Comiskey Park. The use of parentheses in the proposed move target is unfortunate, but Wikipedia does not always decide what products are named. If X was the original name of Twitter, this article would be named appropriately. Threads (social network) is not named P92 or Project 92 because of an aversion of parentheses.

This move request should not cover the status of Twitter under Elon Musk, though discussing a page move if this article is moved would not be improper. As wbm1058 stated, "scope-changing issues are problematic with project guidelines." Consensus would have been solidified if moving Twitter under Elon Musk to X (social network) had not been proposed. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 22:13, 25 August 2024 (UTC)